Thread: The Lie of "free will" demolished by Scripture.
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The Lie of "free will" demolished by Scripture.
Posted : 22 Aug, 2011 06:54 PM
The Lie of "free will" demolished by Scripture.
James intros: I refuse to debate those five points of doctrine known as the doctrines of grace or Calvinism, unless we agree on this first point. Fallen mankind is totally unable and unwilling to come to faith in Jesus. If you can read the following verses and ACCEPT them, as God's truth about all mankind, then I could see discussing the other four points. But if you REJECT the verses below, then forget it. If you won't accept what the Bible plainly teaches about fallen mankind, then WHY should I discuss with you what the Bible teaches about Jesus, or God, or salvation? Total Depravity 1. Man is constituted a sinner by his relationship with Adam Psa 51:5 Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me. Psa 58:3 The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies. Rom 5:18-19 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life. For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous. 2. He is therefore unable A) To do anything good Gen 6:5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. Job 15:14-16 What is man, that he should be clean? and he which is born of a woman, that he should be righteous? Behold, he putteth no trust in his saints; yea, the heavens are not clean in his sight. How much more abominable and filthy is man, which drinketh iniquity like water? Psa 130:3 If thou, LORD, shouldest mark iniquities, O Lord, who shall stand? Psa 143:2 And enter not into judgment with thy servant: for in thy sight shall no man living be justified. Pro 20:9 Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin? Ecc 7:20 For there is not a just man upon earth, that doeth good, and sinneth not. Isa 64:6 But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away. Jer 13:23 Can the Ethiopian change his skin or the leopard its spots? Then may you also do good who are accustomed to do evil. Joh 3:19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. Rom 3:9-12 What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin; As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one. Jam 3:8 But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison. 1Jo 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. B) To believe in God (or come to him) Joh 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. Joh 6:65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father. Joh 8:43-45 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word. Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not. Joh 10:26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. Joh 12:37-41 But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not on him: That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed? Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again, He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them. These things said Esaias, when he saw his glory, and spake of him. C) To understand the truth Joh 14:17 "the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 1Co 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. D) To seek God Rom 3:10-11 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. 3. He is dead in sins Gen 2:16-17 And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. Joh 3:5-7 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. Eph 2:1-3 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins; Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. Col 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; 4. He is blinded and corrupt in his heart Gen 6:5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. Gen 8:21 And the LORD smelled a sweet savour; and the LORD said in his heart, I will not again curse the ground any more for man's sake; for the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth; neither will I again smite any more every thing living, as I have done. Ecc 9:3 This is an evil among all things that are done under the sun, that there is one event unto all: yea, also the heart of the sons of men is full of evil, and madness is in their heart while they live, and after that they go to the dead. Jer 17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it? Mar 7:21-23 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness: All these evil things come from within, and defile the man. Joh 3:19-21 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in [by] God. Rom 8:7-8 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God. Eph 4:17-19 This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind, Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart: Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness. Eph 5:8 For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: 5. He is captive to sin and Satan Joh 8:34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin. Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. Rom 6:20 For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness. 2Ti 2:25-26 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth; And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will. Titus 3:3 For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another. 1Jo 5:19 And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness. 6. He performs actions freely according to his nature, but his nature is wholly evil Job 14:4 Who can bring a clean thing out of an unclean? not one. Mat 7:16-18 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. Mat 12:33 Either make the tree good, and his fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit. Mar 7:21-23 "For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, "thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lewdness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness. "All these evil things come from within and defile a man." Jam 1:13-14 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
"Dead in Sin" and is born with a "Sinful Nature" and that because of Adam man is born with
Original Sin
Then...yes...I agree.
The problem is James...that Scripture is FULL of verses where God asks Mankind to Choose. If God asks us to Choose...how can it be a "Choice" if we do not have Free Will?
If you do not want to Discuss this in an Open Forum and THREATEN to
"take your ball and go home"
if you do not get things your way...
then you Prove to us that you cannot Defend your New Gospel.
Again...I ask you to show us Scripture that says God has to "Force" Mankind to Believe or else!
Show us Scripture that says God has to "Force" The Holy Spirit down our throats?
Show us Scripture that says God wants us to LOVE HIM by Force...not by our Own Free Will?
Admit it James
All you can do is
"blow smoke around" and tell everyone
"Pay no attention to the man behind the screen!"
You have been "Fed" a False Gospel...Brother. It is a "Seductive" Lie that Millions have Swallowed.
Aren't you afraid of being one of those Christians that will one day say:
Matthew 7:22-23
New International Version (NIV)
22 Many will say to me on that day, �Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?� 23 Then I will tell them plainly, �I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!�
The doctrine of Total Depravity is stated as follows:
"Man, by his fall into a state of sin, hath wholly lost all ability of will to any spiritual good accompanying salvation; so as a natural man, being altogether averse from good, and dead in sin, is not able, by his own strength, to convert himself, or to prepare himself thereunto."
Pretty Clear Language that says Man cannot do ANYTHING
��by his own strength, to convert himself, or to prepare himself thereunto�� and Bring himself to God. (Bottner)
Martin Luther in his book �The Bondage of the Will� writes that man is born with a:
"total inability to will good."
This is Calvin�s version of Original Sin. In Lorraine Bottner�s words:
"to become sinful, men do not wait until the age of accountable actions arrive. Rather, they are apostates from the womb."
So the Calvinist states that since Man is Incapable of �taking that first step� towards God�until God Regenerates him�the Calvinist then �Leaps� to the Conclusion that God
Predetermines Who God will Regenerate and who God will not Regenerate.
In other words who God will bring up to Heaven or who God will send to Hell.
PREDETERMINED!!
So how does God get man to become Regenerated? I mean Man is a DEGENERATE�DEPRAVED�HEATHEN�with no Will of his own except when it comes to Sin. So how does God Regenerate man with The Holy Spirit?
If man is so DEPRAVED and WANTS to REMAIN in Sin�how does God Regenerate him?
The Only way possible is for God to just Grab man and
�Whoosh!� �Here�s The Holy Spirit!�
The only way to Regenerate man (if man does not want to) is to
FORCE MAN INTO RECEIVING THE HOLY SPIRIT!
How else?
Perhaps God can �slip� The Holy Spirit into a man�s martini?
And�again�God does this only to the Ones God CHOOSES (Elects).
Why doesn�t this seem Goofy to you James?
(you write) �What the bible says is that God takes TOTALLY spiritually dead people, and makes them come alive spiritually.� (end)
Yes�this is correct! God does make us �NEW CREATURES��but only After we (by our own Free Will) turn to Him�after Hearing His Voice (Word)�we Believe and Turn to God and through (One) Baptism we are �Born Again�.
That is why it is so Important that we Christians
�Spread The Gospel�.
James,
All five points of your �religion� are Unscriptual. They are Undefendable. You have been Duped my Brother.
It grieves me to hear you try to defend these lies�for you Truly do Love God! It saddens me because I cannot �reach� you�because your mind�your Heart�is Enslaved by Calvin and his theology.
Rightly dividing you will not find the father, forcing himself on any one at anytime in scripture.
Here is another scripture: 5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
Love does not seek it own desire. Amplified says it much gooder.
or rude. It does not demand its own way. It is not irritable, and it keeps no record of being wronged.
English Standard Version (�2001)
or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful;
New American Standard Bible (�1995)
does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered,
International Standard Version (�2008)
and she is never rude; she never thinks just of herself or ever gets annoyed. She never is resentful;
GOD'S WORD� Translation (�1995)
It isn't rude. It doesn't think about itself. It isn't irritable. It doesn't keep track of wrongs.
King James Bible
Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
American King James Version
Does not behave itself unseemly, seeks not her own, is not easily provoked, thinks no evil;
American Standard Version
doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not its own, is not provoked, taketh not account of evil;
Bible in Basic English
Love's ways are ever fair, it takes no thought for itself; it is not quickly made angry, it takes no account of evil;
Douay-Rheims Bible
Is not ambitious, seeketh not her own, is not provoked to anger, thinketh no evil;
Darby Bible Translation
does not behave in an unseemly manner, does not seek what is its own, is not quickly provoked, does not impute evil,
English Revised Version
doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not its own, is not provoked, taketh not account of evil;
Webster's Bible Translation
Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not its own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
Weymouth New Testament
She does not behave unbecomingly, nor seek to aggrandize herself, nor blaze out in passionate anger, nor brood over wrongs.
World English Bible
doesn't behave itself inappropriately, doesn't seek its own way, is not provoked, takes no account of evil;
Young's Literal Translation
doth not act unseemly, doth not seek its own things, is not provoked, doth not impute evil,
Barnes' Notes on the Bible
Doth not behave itself unseemly - (οὐκ ἀσχημονεῖ ouk aschēmonei). This word occurs in 1 Corinthians 7:36. See the note on that verse. It means to conduct improperly, or disgracefully, or in a manner to deserve reproach. Love seeks that which is proper or becoming in the circumstances and relations of life in which we are placed. It prompts to the due respect for superiors, producing veneration and respect for their opinions; and it prompts to a proper regard for inferiors, not despising their rank, their poverty, their dress, their dwellings, their pleasures, their views of happiness; it prompts to the due observance of all the "relations" of life, as those of a husband, wife, parent, child, brother, sister, son, daughter, and produces a proper conduct and deportment in all these relations. The proper idea of the phrase is, that it prompts to all that is fit and becoming in life; and would save from all that is unfit and unbecoming.
There may be included in the word also the idea that it would prevent anything that would be a violation of decency or delicacy. It is well known that the Cynics were in the habit of setting at defiance all the usual ideas of decency; and indeed this was, and is, commonly done in the temples of idolatry and pollution everywhere. Love would prevent this, because it teaches to promote the "happiness" of all, and of course to avoid everything that would offend purity of taste and mar enjoyment. In the same way it prompts to the fit discharge of all the relative duties, because it leads to the desire to promote the happiness of all. And in the same manner it would lead a man to avoid profane and indecent language, improper allusions, double meanings and inuendoes, coarse and vulgar expressions, because such things pain the ear, and offend the heart of purity and delicacy. There is much that is indecent and unseemly still in society that would be corrected by Christian love. What a change would be produced if, under the influence of that love, nothing should be said or done in the various relations of life but what would be "seemly, fit, and decent!" And what a happy influence would the prevalence of this love have on the contact of mankind!
Seeketh not her own - There is, perhaps, not a more striking or important expression in the New Testament than this; or one that more beautifully sets forth the nature and power of that love which is produced by true religion. Its evident meaning is, that it is not selfish; it does not seek its own happiness exclusively or mainly; it does not seek its own happiness to the injury of others. This expression is not, however, to be pressed as if Paul meant to teach that a man should not regard his own welfare at all; or have no respect to his health, his property, his happiness, or his salvation. Every man is bound to pursue such a course of life as will ultimately secure his own salvation. But it is not simply or mainly that he may be happy that he is to seek it. It is, that he may thus glorify God his Saviour; and accomplish the great design which his Maker has had in view in his creation and redemption.
If his happiness is the main or leading thing, it proves that he is supremely selfish; and selfishness is not religion. The expression used here is "comparative," and denotes that this is not the main, the chief, the only thing which one who is under the influence of love or true religion will seek. True religion, or love to others, will prompt us to seek their welfare with self-denial, and personal sacrifice and toil. Similar expressions, to denote comparison, occur frequently in the sacred Scriptures. Thus, where it is said (Hosea 7:6; compare Micah 6:8; Matthew 9:13), "I desired mercy, and not sacrifice;" it is meant, "I desired mercy more than I desired sacrifice; I did not wish that mercy should be forgotten or excluded in the attention to the mere ceremonies of religion." The sense here is, therefore, that a man under the influence of true love or religion does not make his own happiness or salvation the main or leading thing; he does not make all other things subservient to this; he seeks the welfare of others, and desires to promote their happiness and salvation, even at great personal sacrifice and self-denial.
It is the "characteristic" of the man, not that he promotes his own worth, health, happiness, or salvation, but that he lives to do good to others. Love to others will prompt to that, and that alone. There is not a particle of selfishness in true love. It seeks the welfare of others, and of all others. That true religion will produce this, is evident everywhere in the New Testament; and especially in the life of the Lord Jesus, whose whole biography is comprehended in one expressive declaration, "who went about doinG good;" Acts 10:38. It follows from this statement:
(1) That no man is a Christian who lives for himself alone; or who makes it his main business to promote his own happiness and salvation.
(2) no man is a Christian who does not deny himself; or no one who is not willing to sacrifice his own comfort, time, wealth, and ease, to advance the welfare of mankind.
(3) it is this principle which is yet to convert the world. Long since the whole world would have been converted, had all Christians been under its influence. And when all Christians make it their grand object "not" to seek their own, but the good of others; when true charity shall occupy its appropriate place in the heart of every professed child of God, then this world will be speedily converted to the Saviour. Then there will he no lack of funds to spread Bibles and tracts; to sustain missionaries, or to establish colleges and schools; then there will be no lack of people who shall be willing to go to any part of the earth to preach the gospel; and then there will be no lack of prayer to implore the divine mercy on a ruined and perishing world. O may the time soon come when all the selfishness in the human heart shall be dissolved, and when the whole world shall be embraced in the benevolence of Christians, and the time, and talent, and wealth of the whole church shall be regarded as consecrated to God, and employed and expended under the influence of Christian love! Compare the note at 1 Corinthians 10:24.
Is not easily provoked - (παροξύνεται paroxunetai). This word occurs in the New Testament only in one other place. Acts 17:16, "his spirit was stirred within him when he saw the city wholly given to idolatry." See the note on that place. The word properly means to sharpen by, or with, or on anything (from ὀξύς oxus, sharp), and may be applied to the act of sharpening a knife or sword; then it means to sharpen the mind, temper, courage of anyone; to excite, impel, etc. Here it means evidently to rouse to anger; to excite to indignation or wrath. Tyndale renders it, "is not provoked to anger." Our translation does not exactly convey the sense. The word "easily" is not expressed in the original. The translators have inserted it to convey the idea that he who is under the influence of love, though he may he provoked, that is, injured, or though there might be incitements to anger, yet that he would not be roused, or readily give way to it.
The meaning of the phrase in the Greek is, that a man who is under the influence of love or religion is not "prone" to violent anger or exasperation; it is not his character to be hasty, excited, or passionate. He is calm, serious, patient. He looks soberly at things; and though he may be injured, yet he governs his passions, restrains his temper, subdues his feelings. This, Paul says, would be produced by love. And this is apparent. If we are under the influence of benevolence, or love to anyone, we shall not give way to sudden bursts of feeling. We shall look kindly on his actions; put the best construction on his motives; deem it possible that we have mistaken the nature or the reasons of his conduct; seek or desire explanation Matthew 5:23-24; wait till we can look at the case in all its bearings; and suppose it possible that he may be influenced by good motives, and that his conduct will admit a satisfactory explanation. That true religion is designed to produce this, is apparent everywhere in the New Testament, and especially from the example of the Lord Jesus; that it actually does produce it, is apparent from all who come under its influence in any proper manner. The effect of religion is no where else more striking and apparent than in changing a temper naturally quick, excitable, and irritable, to one that is calm, and gentle, and subdued. A consciousness of the presence of God will do much to produce this state of mind; and if we truly loved all people, we should be soon angry with none.
Thinketh no evil - That is, puts the best possible construction on the motives and the conduct of others. This expression also is "comparative." It means that love, or that a person under the influence of love, is not malicious, censorious, disposed to find fault, or to impute improper motives to others. It is not only "not easily provoked," not soon excited, but it is not disposed to "think" that there was any evil intention even in cases which might tend to irritate or exasperate us. It is not disposed to think that there was any evil in the case; or that what was done was with any improper intention or design; that is, it puts the best possible construction on the conduct of others, and supposes, as far as can be done, that it was in consistency with honesty, truth, friendship, and love. The Greek word (λογίζεται logizetai) is that which is commonly rendered "impute," and is correctly rendered here "thinketh." It means, does not reckon, charge, or impute to a man any evil intention or design. We desire to think well of the man whom we love; nor will we think ill of his motives, opinions, or conduct until we are compelled to do so by the most unbreakable evidence. True religion, therefore, will prompt to charitable judging; nor is there a more striking evidence of the destitution of true religion than a disposition to impute the worst motives and opinions to a man.
Clarke's Commentary on the Bible
-6
Doth not behave itself unseemly - Ουκ ασχημονει, from α, negative, and σχημα, figure, mien; love never acts out of its place or character; observes due decorum and good manners; is never rude, bearish, or brutish; and is ever willing to become all things to all men, that it may please them for their good to edification. No ill-bred man, or what is termed rude or unmannerly, is a Christian. A man may have a natural bluntness, or be a clown, and yet there be nothing boorish or hoggish in his manner. I must apologize for using such words; they best express the evil against which I wish both powerfully and successfully to declaim. I never wish to meet with those who affect to be called "blunt, honest men;" who feel themselves above all the forms of respect and civility, and care not how many they put to pain, or how many they displease. But let me not be misunderstood; I do not contend for ridiculous ceremonies, and hollow compliments; there is surely a medium: and a sensible Christian man will not be long at a loss to find it out. Even that people who profess to be above all worldly forms, and are generally stiff enough, yet are rarely found to be rude, uncivil, or ill-bred.
-7
Seeketh not her own - Ου ζητει τα ἑαυτης· Is not desirous of her own spiritual welfare only, but of her neighbour's also: for the writers of the Old and New Testament do, almost every where, agreeably to their Hebrew idiom, express a preference given to one thing before another by an affirmation of that which is preferred, and a negative of that which is contrary to it. See Bishop Pearce, and see the notes on 1 Corinthians 1:17; 1 Corinthians 10:24 (note), and 1 Corinthians 10:33 (note). Love is never satisfied but in the welfare, comfort, and salvation of all. That man is no Christian who is solicitous for his own happiness alone; and cares not how the world goes, so that himself be comfortable.
-8
Is not easily provoked - Ου παροξυνεται· Is not provoked, is not irritated, is not made sour or bitter. How the word easily got into our translation it is hard to say; but, however it got in, it is utterly improper, and has nothing in the original to countenance it. By the transcript from my old MS., which certainly contains the first translation ever made in English, we find that the word did not exist there, the conscientious translator rendering it thus: - It is not stirid to wrath.
The New Testament, printed in 1547, 4to., the first year of Edward VI., in English and Latin, has simply, is not provokeed to angre. The edition published in English in the following year, 1548, has the same rendering, but the orthography better: is not provoked to anger. The Bible in folio, with notes, published the next year, 1549, by Edmund Becke, preserves nearly the same reading, is not provoketh to anger. The large folio printed by Richard Cardmarden, at Rouen, 1566, has the same reading. The translation made and printed by the command of King James I., fol., 1611, etc. departs from all these, and improperly inserts the word easily, which might have been his majesty's own; and yet this translation was not followed by some subsequent editions; for the 4to. Bible printed at London four years after, 1615, not only retains this original and correct reading, it is not provoked to anger, but has the word love every where in this chapter instead of charity, in which all the preceding versions and editions agree. In short, this is the reading of Coverdale, Matthews, Cranmer, the Geneva, and others; and our own authorized version is the only one which I have seen where this false reading appears.
As to the ancient versions, they all, Vulgate, Syriac, Arabic, Ethiopic, Coptic, and Itala, strictly follow the Greek text; and supply no word that tends to abate the signification of the apostle's ου παροξυνεται, is not provoked; nor is there a various reading here in all the numerous MSS. It is of importance to make these observations, because the common version of this place destroys the meaning of the apostle, and makes him speak very improperly. If love is provoked at all; it then ceases to be love; and if it be not easily provoked, this grants, as almost all the commentators say, that in special cases it may be provoked; and this they instance in the case of Paul and Barnabas, Acts 15:39; but I have sufficiently vindicated this passage in my note on that place, and given at large the meaning of the word παροξυνω; and to that place I beg leave to refer the reader. The apostle's own words in 1 Corinthians 13:7, are a sufficient proof that the love of which he speaks can never be provoked. When the man who possesses this love gives way to provocation, he loses the balance of his soul, and grieves the Spirit of God. In that instant he ceases from loving God with all his soul, mind, and strength; and surely if he get embittered against his neighbor, he does not love him as himself. It is generally said that, though a man may feel himself highly irritated against the sin, he may feel tender concern for the sinner. Irritation of any kind is inconsistent with self-government, and consequently with internal peace and communion with God. However favourably we may think of our own state, and however industrious we may be to find out excuses for sallies of passion, etc., still the testimony of God is, Love is not provoked; and if I have not such a love, whatever else I may possess, it profiteth me nothing.
-9
Thinketh no evil - Ουλογιζεται το κακον· "Believes no evil where no evil seems." Never supposes that a good action may have a bad motive; gives every man credit for his profession of religion, uprightness, godly zeal, etc., while nothing is seen in his conduct or in his spirit inconsistent with this profession. His heart is so governed and influenced by the love of God, that he cannot think of evil but where it appears. The original implies that he does not invent or devise any evil; or, does not reason on any particular act or word so as to infer evil from it; for this would destroy his love to his brother; it would be ruinous to charity and benevolence.
Gill's Exposition of the Entire Bible
Doth not behave itself unseemly,.... By using either unbecoming words, or doing indecent actions; for a man unprincipled with this grace will be careful that no filthy and corrupt communication proceed out of his mouth, which may offend pious ears; and that he uses no ridiculous and ludicrous gestures, which may expose himself and grieve the saints; accordingly the Syriac version renders it, "neither does it commit that which is shameful": such an one will not do a little mean despicable action, in reproaching one, or flattering another, in order to gain a point, to procure some worldly advantage, or an interest in the friendship and affection of another. Some understand it in this sense, that one endued with this grace thinks nothing unseemly and unbecoming him, however mean it may appear, in which he can be serviceable to men, and promote the honour of religion and interest of Christ; though it be by making coats and garments for the poor, as Dorcas did; or by washing the feet of the saints, in imitation of his Lord and master: or "is not ambitious", as the Vulgate Latin version reads; of honour and applause, and of being in the highest form, but is lowly, meek and humble:
seeketh not her own things: even those which are "lawful", as the Arabic version renders it; but seeks the things of God, and what will make most for his honour and glory; and the things of Christ, and what relate to the spread of his Gospel, and the enlargement of his kingdom; and also the things of other men, the temporal and spiritual welfare of the saints: such look not only on their own things, and are concerned for them, but also upon the things of others, which they likewise care for:
is not easily provoked: to wrath, but gives place to it: such an one is provoked at sin, at immorality and idolatry, as Paul's spirit was stirred up or provoked, when he saw the superstition of the city of Athens; and is easily provoked to love and good works, which are entirely agreeable to the nature of charity:
thinketh no evil; not but that evil thoughts are in such a man's heart, for none are without them; though they are hateful, abominable, and grieving to such as are partakers of the grace of God, who long to be delivered from them: but the meaning is, either that one possessed of this grace of love does not think of the evil that is done him by another; he forgives, as God has forgiven him, so as to forget the injury done him, and remembers it no more; and so the Arabic version reads it, "and remembers not evil"; having once forgiven it, he thinks of it no more; or he does not meditate revenge, or devise mischief, and contrive evil against man that has done evil to him, as Esau did against his brother Jacob; so the Ethiopic version, by way of explanation, adds, "neither thinks evil, nor consults evil"; or as the word here used will bear to be rendered, "does not impute evil"; reckon or place it to the account of him that has committed it against him, but freely and fully forgives, as God, when he forgives sin, is said not to impute it; or such an one is not suspicious of evil in others, he does not indulge evil surmises, and groundless jealousies; which to do is very contrary to this grace of love.
Easily is superfluous, and gives a wrong coloring to the statement, which is absolute: is not provoked or exasperated. The verb occurs only here and Acts 17:16. The kindred noun παροξυσμός, in Acts 15:39, describes the irritation which arose between Paul and Barnabas. In Hebrews 10:24, stimulating to good works. It is used of provoking God, Deuteronomy 9:8; Psalm 105:29; Isaiah 65:3.
Thinketh no evil (οὐ λογίζεται τὸ κακόν)
Lit., reckoneth not the evil. Rev., taketh not account of. The evil; namely, that which is done to love. "Love, instead of entering evil as a debt in its account-book, voluntarily passes the sponge over what it endures" (Godet).
Geneva Study Bible
Doth {e} not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
(e) It is not insolent, or reproachful.
People's New Testament
13:5 Doth not behave itself unseemly. Discourteously and in a way to shock good manners or morals.
Seeketh not its own. Is unselfish and disinterested. See Ro 12:10.
Is not easily provoked. Does not fly into a rage, but keeps the temper under control.
Thinketh no evil. Taketh not account of evil. The idea of the Revised Version is that love does not keep a record of evil rendered so as to return it.
Wesley's Notes
13:5 It doth not behave indecently - Is not rude, or willingly offensive, to any. It renders to all their due - Suitable to time, person, and all other circumstances. Seeketh not her own - Ease, pleasure, honour, or temporal advantage. Nay, sometimes the lover of mankind seeketh not, in some sense, even his own spiritual advantage; does not think of himself, so long as a zeal for the glory of God and the souls of men swallows him up. But, though he is all on fire for these ends, yet he is not provoked to sharpness or unkindness toward any one. Outward provocations indeed will frequently occur; but he triumphs over all. Love thinketh no evil - Indeed it cannot but see and hear evil things, and know that they are so; but it does not willingly think evil of any; neither infer evil where it does not appear. It tears up, root and branch, all imagining of what we have not proof. It casts out all jealousies, all evil surmises, all readiness to believe evil.
Jamieson-Fausset-Brown Bible Commentary
5. not . unseemly-is not uncourteous, or inattentive to civility and propriety.
thinketh no evil-imputeth not evil [Alford]; literally, "the evil" which actually is there (Pr 10:12; 1Pe 4:8). Love makes allowances for the falls of others, and is ready to put on them a charitable construction. Love, so far from devising evil against another, excuses "the evil" which another inflicts on her [Estius]; doth not meditate upon evil inflicted by another [Bengel]; and in doubtful cases, takes the more charitable view [Grotius].
Matthew Henry's Concise Commentary
13:4-7 Some of the effects of charity are stated, that we may know whether we have this grace; and that if we have not, we may not rest till we have it. This love is a clear proof of regeneration, and is a touchstone of our professed faith in Christ. In this beautiful description of the nature and effects of love, it is meant to show the Corinthians that their conduct had, in many respects, been a contrast to it. Charity is an utter enemy to selfishness; it does not desire or seek its own praise, or honour, or profit, or pleasure. Not that charity destroys all regard to ourselves, or that the charitable man should neglect himself and all his interests. But charity never seeks its own to the hurt of others, or to neglect others. It ever prefers the welfare of others to its private advantage. How good-natured and amiable is Christian charity! How excellent would Christianity appear to the world, if those who profess it were more under this Divine principle, and paid due regard to the command on which its blessed Author laid the chief stress! Let us ask whether this Divine love dwells in our hearts. Has this principle guided us into becoming behaviour to all men? Are we willing to lay aside selfish objects and aims? Here is a call to watchfulness, diligence, and prayer.
James have enjoyed some of your posts but do not agree with all of them. I believe you present only those scriptures that you think tend to back up your view. Consider this, do you think God really would command the unregenerated person to repent when he can not? What kind of sick games do you think God is into? Or could it be possible that we do not fully understand how to harmonize scripture? "And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth ALL MEN EVERY WHERE TO REPENT; because he hath appointed a day, in which he will judge the world in RIGHTOUSNESS by that man whom he ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto ALL MEN, in that he hath raised him from the dead." Acts 30-32 If this command is given to ALL MEN and they can not repent it is a meaningless command because they cannot. If it is only given to the elect it is a meaningless command because it would happen anyway.
Jesus said: The kingdom of heaven is like a king who arranged a marriage for his son, and set out for his servants to call those who were invited to the wedding; and they were NOT WILLING TO COME..."The wedding is ready, but those who were invited were not worthy. Therefore go into the highways, and invite AS MANY AS YOU FIND, INVITE TO THE WEDDING." So those servants went out into the highways and gathered together all whom they found, BOTH BAD AND GOOD. And the wedding hall was filled with guests. But when the king came in to see the guests, he saw a man there who did not have on a wedding garment. So he said to him,"Friend how did you come in here without a wedding garment?" And he was speechless. Then the king said to the servants,"Bind him hand and foot, take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth." For many are called but few are chosen. Matthew 22:2-14.
I believe the above parable illustrates God calls and WE CAN AND MUST BE WILLING TO RESPOND, WE MUST PUT ON THE WEDDING GARMENT THAT THE KING GIVES US(THE RIGHTOUSNESS OF CHRIST) in order to be chosen. This parable is from Christ and in my opinion trumps any theological speculation that we can not respond when God calls, but must be willing. People try to uphold God's sovereignty by doing away with man's free will, but God is big enough to give man choice "chose this day whom you will serve" and remain completely sovereign.
Is man in a state of depravity? Of course he is. Can God pierce that darkness by his word and spirit and call unto man? Of course he does. So let us not deny the sovereignty of God working as it works with the free will of man.
I know you all can not take the length of theology.
I will leave you with one example.
Have you ever had people come to your church who you thought were Christians, all of a sudden they stop going to church, living their lives as the world does, and it leaves you to sit and wonder why?
It is because they were not christians at all they were trying to live a christian life of their own free will. I know i tried it. From baptist to catholic to non denominational. Until God changed my heart nothing i did of myself changed that stony heart i had. I always ended in the gutter of misery.
I've always assumed people with a point to make would be able to make it succinctly. The more confused they are, the more long-winded and rambling their posts.
I know you all can not take the length of theology.
I will leave you with one example.
Have you ever had people come to your church who you thought were Christians, all of a sudden they stop going to church, living their lives as the world does, and it leaves you to sit and wonder why?
It is because they were not christians at all they were trying to live a christian life of their own free will. I know i tried it. From baptist to catholic to non denominational. Until God changed my heart nothing i did of myself changed that stony heart i had. I always ended in the gutter of misery.
Jesus answered your statement and your answer is not in scripture.
18 Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower.
19 When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.
20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
22 He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.
23 But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.
Very clear in this context some heard and believed and some went forward, and each that did not, it was their fault.
