Thread: Is there such a thing as a guy being too honest?
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Is there such a thing as a guy being too honest?
Posted : 4 Aug, 2012 12:56 PM
Hello lady's and gentleman. I got a complex problem for those women who love a good challenge. I'm always hearing women tell me that they want an honest and nice man. And in my book honesty has to be one of the greatest virtues of godly character -- expescially in this modern age. I don't have a problem getting a woman. It's keeping them. See, in my past relationships I have enjoyed getting to honor God (because God hates lairs) and being extremely honest and upfront with my long list of ex-girlfriends. It's not that I spill my guts out too them lol. But each woman besides telling me that I'm the greatest Guy they've ever been with, has also told me their reasons for leaving and there all along the lines of me being too honest. So, I got to wonder a few things... Is there any woman who really does cherish honesty and not just say they do but back it up with action? Should I stop being honest towards women, because I see other guys who seem to have no character at all have more luck at making into a longer term relationships and marriage then us righteous men do. ( I'll admit that a lot of that has to do with them getting a woman pregnant before marriage. But my point is there.. it works and if you have to trick someone into marriage these days then what's the point ) I also think about a larger perspective. In a Lady gaga inspired, short skirt world -- where seeing a woman or man naked is just a click away: Is there anyone that want's to be valued, wants to be different from the world, and wants to holy. Enough to please God By acting on that desire with every step they make. I see so many women say on their profile's how happy they are in a world that the Bible says is ruled by the devil until Christ returns. Their number one quality that they are looking for in a man. "That he makes her laugh." Entertainment? Really? I'm honestly feeling kind of defeated right now because no one seems to get the bigger picture from God's perspective. Anyway, God bless and thanks to any opinions that come my way. If your confused what I'm asking, " Is there such a thing as being too honest and if there is, how much should I lie about? Because telling people the truth isn't working.. they seem to want some kind of disneyland princess experience... which I don't know how that's going to help in a marriage but whatever lol.
Yes, I am familar with the say. Many Christians use the clich� �hate the sin, Love the sinner.� However, we must realize that this is an exhortation to us as imperfect human beings. The difference between us and God in regard to loving and hating is vast. Even as Christians, we remain imperfect in our humanity and cannot love perfectly, nor can we hate perfectly (in other words, without malice). But God can do both of these perfectly, because He is God. God can hate without any sinful intent-- the righteous and jealous hate of the lord is different from our hate. Before you ask is there such a thing -- God loved Jacob and hates Esau (Malachi 1:3; Romans 9:13)
Therefore, He can hate the sin and the sinner in a perfectly holy way and still be willing to lovingly forgive at the moment of that sinner's repentance and faith (Malachi 1:3; Revelation 2:6; 2 Peter 3:9).
The Bible clearly teaches that God is love. First John 4:8-9 says, �Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love. This is how God showed his love among us: He sent his one and only Son into the world that we might live through him.� Mysterious but true is the fact that God can perfectly love and hate a person at the same time. This means He can love him as someone He created and can redeem, as well as hate him for his unbelief and sinful lifestyle. We, as imperfect human beings, cannot do this; thus, we must remind ourselves to �love the sinner, hate the sin.�
How exactly does that work? From my point of view: We hate sin by refusing to take part in it and by condemning it when we see it. Sin is to be hated, not excused or taken lightly. We love sinners by being faithful in witnessing to them of the forgiveness that is available through Jesus Christ and repenting from sin -- there's a turning away from sin and a turning towards Christ -- a Change in lifestyle. A true act of love is treating someone with respect and kindness even though he/she knows you do not approve of his/her lifestyle and/or choices. It is not loving to allow a person to remain stuck in sin. It is not hateful to tell a person he/she is in sin. In fact, the exact opposites are true. We love the sinner by speaking the truth in love. We hate the sin by refusing to condone, ignore, or excuse it.
I also want to ask you a question about this.. How can God throw just Sin and not a sinner into hell? It's hard to say that throwing someone into a place like Hell is an act of love becase it is a place of torture. So I am wondering what you thoughts are of this??
We asume everyone wants to be with God in heaven. If you have time to read this very long writing of mine please do.
It is titled hell your making your doing.........
Not to many people like to talk about this topic. I would rather encourage individuals with the love, Grace and Mercy of God.
But I think I need to write concerning this topic because I believe it is misunderstood by both Christians and non believers.
As Christians we need to be clear about this topic with individuals so we represent God properly and in truth.
The big question we hear is how can a loving God send people to hell?
I will address this question latter. Lets look at why hell is hell.
What makes up the fire of hell? How does fire burn eternally? How is a person in fire yet not consumed? What makes up the worm in hell? Why is hell complete darkness?
If we look at the nature of who God is then hell makes sense. But we have to understand in fullness who God is.
I would wounder about these sort of questions but since they really didn't effect my life they didn't seem to matter much. I have come to understand that knowing the answer helps me to relate to those individuals the reality of hell in a personal sense. It helps me to put the responsibility where it truly belongs. You see God relates to us personally but we don't really think about how hell will relate to individuals personally as well.
To answer the questions about what makes the fire, worm etc of hell? It will be the individual's hatred of God that will burn like fire inside them. It will be the individuals knowledge of who God is in His fullness and love toward them. The love they personally rejected. Them remembering for eternity all the times God reached out to them. This will be a worm eating inside them. When they stand before God He will reveal all this to them. God will reveal the perfect plan He had for their lives. God will reveal His sacrifice and His payment that was made personally on their behalf.
I personally believe these individuals will experience in fullness the pure full love of God. I personally believe they will experience the express broken heart of God toward their rejection of Him.
But throughout eternity their remembering will not produce love in return toward God but a deeper hatred for God and even more so a hatred of their selves. They will have a hatred for those who led them in their lies toward God.
You see Hell will be the ever increasing emotions of hatred, loneliness, dispair. These emotions will eat and burn at individuals for eternity never allowing allowing them to be consumed.
The people who feel they are living good lives and even those who are deluded in thinking they are following God will also experience these intense feelings. They will spend eternity blaming God. They will spend eternity in their hatred toward God, for Him not being part of their self delusion and self exaltation.
They will spend eternity in their minds eye believing they should have gotten in to heaven on their good works. Even though they see and experience the purity of Jesus righteousness they will in their pride blame God. They will spend eternity in hatred toward God.
You see I can relate to this because if it were me I would feel this way toward God. Thanks be it to God I don't feel nothing but love for Him. It is because He loved me so deeply that my heart responds toward love to Him.
Any ways...Now we can relate better in what the experience of Hell will be like. I don't have any concrete evidence of these things because I have never been there and it is is not really spelled our in scripture like this. So this is one mans opinion on the individuals experience of hell.
But understanding my own human nature and the nature of God helps me to draw these sort of conclusions. It helps me understand more what the experience must look like.
I believe the punishment of Hell will be self inflicted. This is the bottom line. Since God will not be there and since Satin will be bound and since individuals will be alone. Oh they might be capable of hearing other moans and cries and even the hatred coming out of other individuals. They will be so wrapped up in self that nothing else and no one else will matter to them.
We see evidence of this already in our physical world. Youths cutting and damaging their bodies out of self hatred and self mutilation. Their damaging their selves out of hatred for some abuse they experienced. We see individuals, families, cities, states and counties in decline due to the egotistic selfish nature of individuals.This is the result of a sin filled world we are a part of.
Look around you and see the hatred in the eyes of people. The hatred that is growing toward God and one another.
This brings me to the last question. Why does a loving God send individuals to hell?
Well He doesn't....What He doesn't. That is what I have been taught by my pastor.
If I were to tell you that their are some things that God can not do, how would you feel about that. Would you respond....Well He is God and He can do anything.
You are wrong. God can not do anything.
He can not go against His nature. He cant make a rock to big to lift which is silly to think about any way.
But concerning Hell. God is pure and perfect. He can not allow any thing that defiles in His presence. Or should I say it this way. NOTHING that is defiled can withstand His presence.
Do you hear this. Those individuals who are defiled will NOT be able to withstand His presence. Those individuals who have rejected God will not all of a sudden want God.
You see it is the Spirit of God in us. His Spirit causes our hearts over time to want God more and more. When God reached out to us and we responded to Him our hearts were now joined with the Spirit of God.
These individuals that stand one day in the presence of God alone. By their selves. They will not want God then or ever.
Then they, their selves will want to flee from Gods presence and God in agreement with them will cast them out of His presence.
So what is out side of Gods presence. Nothingness....No light or beauty. No joy or peace. No love or forgiveness. No Grace or Mercy. Not even any of Gods creation because even in Gods creation is His Glory.
So what is left that is out side of Gods presence? Rejecting individuals. Individuals who have rejected God.
They will make up Hell. Their own emotions will be their torture. They will torture their selves through out eternity.
So don't ever allow another to put the blame on God for hell. Don't ever allow your self to blame God for anything destructive.
We bring it upon our selves. Other sin filled individuals bring it upon us.
If need be now you can defend your faith and even defend God.
But get to know Him more or Just reach out to get to know Him for the first time. You have a life time and even a eternity moving either toward God or away from Him.
God wants every individual to want Him and so do I. I agree with God in His desire that NO individual will perish but have ever lasting life.
You have to look at the scripture in context and not just as an anecdote. In the passage you posted, it's not talking about the "hate" we are familiar with. You seem to understand that but you have this notion that there is such a thing as "perfect hate" (loving without malice).
God CHOSE Jacob over his brother Esau (aka Edom) to be the Father of the people. As such, we read "God loves Jacob" and "God hates Esau". If we look at Father Abraham, we know that Abraham was one of the most, if not the most, blessed man by God. God chose Abraham to be the Father of the people. It would be no different than God saying, "I love Abraham and everyone else I hate" because he chose Abraham.
It's important to read things contextually. If this passage all by itself is the only reason to justify God hating sinners, then I'd counsel you to go back and study the passage and/or find any other passage where it suggests God hating sinners.
As cliche as it might be, it doesn't change the validity and truthfulness of this fact that God doesn't hate. Where did you get this definition of "perfect hate" by the way? Is it a personal belief/extra-biblical or is it mentioned throughout the bible? I'd like to look into it if there is such a thing.
Its throughout the bible. I agree with you on context is important but that's not the only passage where I find that a just, holy and loving God can't afford to personalize or play favorites as suggested by him hating only the sin and not the person who willingly committed it by there own free will. it's also better if you read the bible in it's original context of Hebrew or Greek if we're going to talk about proper context ;) Opens up a whole new world of understanding.
but as far as the concept of "perfect hate" goes here's an example of it within the bible.
Psalm 139:22 I hate them with a perfect hatred: I count them mine enemies.
I realize we could go at this all week and be sharing bible passages back and forth. but we gone completely off topic. From the role of honesty in a dating relationship to defining God as he has shown himself in his word.
I really have enjoyed talking about our difference in opinions and faith. I am really glad that we had an conversion without insulting each other or offending one another. I have no doubts that you are a great guy and have very valuable points and I value what you have taken the time to show me but I don't know if you noticed lol Ever since we started our conversation. Hardly, none of the women have stated their points of view. So since it is an "ask a girl" forum. I'm silencing my opinion for now to allow them to state theirs.
God bless bro. we could continue this in live chat or by private massage if you would like but I like to let the bible defend itself and let men or women decide for themselves what's go for them. Proverbs 29:27 is another good verse when it comes to hating sin or sin hating righteousness. please notice that it's people not a spiritual force that's detestable to one another. And with that ladies you have the forum.. What do you think about what was just said or about the original question?
