The word of God teaches man can and does believe all thru the Old testament.
It is the topic of Faith.
Every time it is posted you ignore it, because it expose's your private interpretation's or opinion's.
Answer have an ear to hear and eyes to see for Jesus taught us it is a choice, but some chose to harden their heart and thus they can not see nor hear.
Pr 28:9 He that turneth away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be abomination.
Mt 13:13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
Mt 13:14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
Mt 13:15 For this people�s heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
This not only the truth, but for those that want to know truth, it is a revelation.
In Romans 9, when Paul is speaking very clearly of God's unconditional election of some, and not others, to eternal salvation, a hypothetical objector to this doctrine raises that very question: �If it is as you say, Paul, and God loved Jacob and hated Esau before they were born, or had done anything good or bad, just so that his own purposes might stand in election, does that not mean he is arbitrary and unjust?� (see Rom. 9:14). Paul's response to this is a resounding, �Of course not! May it never be!� God is not arbitrary or unjust � but he does elect individuals to mercy and hardens others as he sees fit, and for no good will or exertion that he sees in anyone (Rom. 9:15-16). He hardened Pharaoh according to his purpose of displaying his glory in all the earth, and he sovereignly chooses to have mercy on whomever he will, to display the glory of his grace (Rom. 9:17; cf. Rom. 9:22-24). In sum, �Therefore, he has mercy on whom he will and he hardens whom he will� (Rom. 9:18).
We would do well to heed Christ's parable of the workers in the vineyard (Matthew 20:1-16): just because God chooses to have mercy upon some does not make him unjust or arbitrary for giving to others their just deserts. It is his free, undeserved mercy and grace that he holds forth in salvation, and he may do with it as he will. We may not fathom the deep and mysterious ways of God (Rom. 11:33-36); but woe to that one who foolishly says, �I see no reason for why God chooses some and not others, so he must be arbitrary and unjust�. On the contrary, O foolish man, you would do well to say with Job, �Behold, I am of little worth; what shall I answer you? I lay my hand upon my mouth� (Job 40:4).
We would challenge you to wrestle with the following verses. Paul encountered this very same argument against election in Romans 9:18-23; that it would make God unjust and arbitrary:
18 So then He has mercy on whom He desires, and He hardens whom He desires.
19 You will say to me then, "Why does He still find fault? For who resists His will?"
20 On the contrary, who are you, O man, who answers back to God? The thing molded will not say to the molder, "Why did you make me like this," will it?
21Or does not the potter have a right over the clay, to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for common use?
22 What if God, although willing to demonstrate His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction?
23 And He did so to make known the riches of His glory upon vessels of mercy, which He prepared beforehand for glory,
To begin with, Paul would not ask this hypothetical question unless He believed the ultimate determination of ones salvation to be in the hands of God alone. Paul is saying that God has the sovereign right to do with us whatever He wants. Will you deny Him this right? This points to an even greater truth: that there is no higher principle in the universe than God Himself. The Hebrew God of the Bible is nothing like the Greek gods which must yield to some greater truth. God is the ultimate Truth and therefore, if He determines something it is, by definition, not arbitrary. In other words, there is no better reason for anything than the fact that God determines it. We should draw no comfort from the theology that promotes a god who must yield to something greater than Himself. Further, since we know the character of God we must not think that, on His side, God had no internal reasons or causes for saving some and not others - - �since the divine purpose always conspires with His wisdom and does nothing without reason or rashly; although these reasons and causes have not been revealed to us. In His counsels and works no cause is apparent, it is yet hidden with Him, so that He has decreed nothing except justly and wisely according to His good pleasure founded on His gracious love towards us.� Just because we don�t know His internal reason for choosing some to faith and not others is not reason enough to reject it. In the absence of relevant data, we, therefore, have no reason whatsoever to assume the worse, so there are no legitimate grounds for doubting the goodness of God here. Therefore, to doubt that God can choose us based solely on his good pleasure, is to doubt the goodness of God. The "foreseen faith" people are, in effect, saying that they cannot trust God in making this choice and prefer it to be left up to the fallen individual, as if he would make a better choice than God. This would also make God's love toward us conditional and based on some inherent talent, wisdom or strength found in the individual rather than in God Himself
Well wheather or not they are going to have the guts to argue with God..lol I still believe that he will have given them the chance to know him he will give every soul a chance to repeant at some point
@Donna So we have no fee will? We are just destened to d whatever God forces us to do?
I myself from my own experience know this to be true,
I am saved by grace and i dont deserve it
I still have flesh and it pulls me and tries to make me sin
I sometimes give in and mess up
But I never give up
I continue to repent and stay in Christ Putting my sins under his blood asking him to show me the way
BUT I could at any time make the choice to turn back to my old life and live in sin give up my salvationand have my "name blotted out"
So I know that God knows what we will do and who will heed his call and who will deny him but that doesnt mean he doesnt ever call them, he will call everyone give everyone the chance
If God does everything if we have to do nothing then why the great commision, why does it matter? why should I be about my fathers buisness taking the gospel of the cross to sinners? WHATS THE POINT?Is it a divinly santioned wild goose chase? NO WAY God doesnt do things that way every man has salvation availible to him that doesnt mean every man will recieve salvation
OH YEAH and why would we pray for the salvation of sinners. why does Jesus COMAND us to pray for our enemies? ARE our prayers in vain?? AGAIN I say NO WAY Gods mind can be changed as Moses convinced God to change his mind and so can we..
I garauntee that If my daddy had not been praying for his drug addicted completly lost sadly imoral daughter for so many years then God would have hardend my heart but instead he plucked my out of my sin and stood me on higher ground I think prayer changes things and yes God knows the final outcome but he never forces him self on us we choose to serve him, he may have chosen to save us be we choose to serve him and we must choose to serve him daily to keep this salvation because in no time if we dont serve him and sacrifice our praises to him we will turn back to our sin and be blotted out
Any gospel preaching that relies upon an act of the human will for the conversion of sinners has missed the mark. Any sinner who supposes that his will has the strength to do any good accompanying salvation is greatly deluded and far from the kingdom. We are cast back upon the regenerating work of the Spirit of the living GOD to make the tree good. Unless GOD does something in the sinner, unless GOD creates a clean heart and renews a right spirit within man, there is no hope of a saving change. ~ Walter J. Chantry
Any gospel preaching that relies upon an act of the human will for the conversion of sinners has missed the mark. Any sinner who supposes that his will has the strength to do any good accompanying salvation is greatly deluded and far from the kingdom. We are cast back upon the regenerating work of the Spirit of the living GOD to make the tree good. Unless GOD does something in the sinner, unless GOD creates a clean heart and renews a right spirit within man, there is no hope of a saving change. ~ Walter J. Chantry
This is abomination before God denying his word the truth, and a perfect example of man's ability to believe as he desires and as in this case against the word of God.
This statement is in complete denial of the ever living word of God and in denial of the love of God.
James btw that is my Father you keep speaking evil of:
s the simple action of men in unbelief, endeavoring to make the word of God of none effect. as is the manner of some it has nothing to do with the integrity of the word of God.
Some do chose to corrupt the word of God and a corrupted seed can not reproduce, here is an example:
Some have put together a teaching unto themselves proclaiming that man in his fallen spiritual state can not exercise faith according to the word of God.
He according to them does not have the ability to believe.
The word of God tells man to choose whom he will serve:
In this instruction we can see and hear man's ability to do just as the word of God instructs. This is always true!!
The essence is on the word of God fro this same word teaches us that the word of God has the ability:
To illuminate the heart of fallen man
To produce faith in the heart of fallen man, as man cooperates
with the word of God
Every seed produces after it's own kind, in the light of the word of God the ability of the seed is in the seed declared.
Here is an example:
Ps 107:20 He sent his word, and healed them, and delivered them from their destructions.
Any that will have an ear to hear this word and believe and receive it as their's in their heart will be healed.
This is exactly what is declared in this scripture concerning being born again:
1Pe 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
This not a work of the Holy Spirit it is the seed of God's word concerning the new birth that illuminates the heart of man then produces faith in the heart of man and then the confession of the mouth, and then the Holy Spirit removes the Old Spirit and puts in man's body a new spirit that is now alive unto God completely free of sin.
Isa 55:11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.
Daniel 4:35 all the inhabitants of the earth are accounted as nothing, and he does according to his will among the host of heaven and among the inhabitants of the earth; and none can stay his hand or say to him, "What have you done?"
Proverbs 16:33 The lot is cast into the lap, But its every decision [is] from the LORD.
Exodus 6:7 I will take you as My people, and I will be your God. Then you shall know that I [am] the LORD your God who brings you out from under the burdens of the Egyptians.
Deuteronomy 7:6 "For you [are] a holy people to the LORD your God; the LORD your God has chosen you to be a people for Himself, a special treasure above all the peoples on the face of the earth.
Matthew 23:37 "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the one who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under [her] wings, but you were not willing!
Matthew 11:27 "All things have been delivered to Me by My Father, and no one knows the Son except the Father. Nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and the one to whom the Son wills to reveal Him.
John 3:19-20 And this is the condemnation, that the light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. (20) For everyone practicing evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed.
Acts 2:39 For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself."
{The Lord does the calling, not man}
Acts 2:47 praising God and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily those who were being saved.
Titus 3:5 He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,
Romans 9:29 And as Isaiah said before: "Unless the LORD of Sabaoth had left us a seed, We would have become like Sodom, And we would have been made like Gomorrah."
{If God had not elected some to salvation, all would be lost; had God not chosen some, none would be saved.}
Ephesians 1:5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
Ephesians 2:1-5 And you [He made alive], who were dead in trespasses and sins, (2) in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience, (3) among whom also we all once conducted ourselves in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, just as the others. (4) But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, (5) even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved),
{Believers are saved by God's mercy & grace, NOT by man's (freewill?) choice.}
Ephesians 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
Philippians 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.
Ephesians 1:11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:
James 1:18 Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.
John 1:13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
1 John 4:19 We love Him because He first loved us.
Ephesians 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
1 Corinthians 3:7 So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.
1 Corinthians 4:7 For who makes you differ [from another]? And what do you have that you did not receive? Now if you did indeed receive [it], why do you boast as if you had not received [it]?
2 Corinthians 5:18 Now all things are of God, who has reconciled us to Himself through Jesus Christ, and has given us the ministry of reconciliation,
Romans 9:16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.
Psa 118:8 It is better to trust in the LORD Than to put confidence in man.
2 Timothy 1:9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,
Romans 10:20 But Esaias is very bold, and saith, I was found of them that sought me not; I was made manifest unto them that asked not after me.
Romans 9:11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;)
Psalms 37:23 The steps of a good man are ordered by the LORD: and he delighteth in his way.
Jeremiah 10:23 O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps.
Ephesians 1:9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:
Mark 10:24-27 And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God! (25) It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. (26) And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved? (27) And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.
Isaiah 65:12 Therefore I will number you for the sword, And you shall all bow down to the slaughter; Because, when I called, you did not answer; When I spoke, you did not hear, But did evil before My eyes, And chose [that] in which I do not delight."
Isaiah 66:4 So will I choose their delusions, And bring their fears on them; Because, when I called, no one answered, When I spoke they did not hear; But they did evil before My eyes, And chose [that] in which I do not delight."
Psalms 47:2-4 For the LORD Most High is awesome; He is a great King over all the earth. (3) He will subdue the peoples under us, And the nations under our feet. (4) He will choose our inheritance for us, The excellence of Jacob whom He loves. Selah
Isaiah 55:11 So shall My word be that goes forth from My mouth; It shall not return to Me void, But it shall accomplish what I please, And it shall prosper in the thing for which I sent it.
1 Peter 1:3-5 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! According to his great mercy, he has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, (4) to an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, kept in heaven for you, (5) who by God's power are being guarded through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
Acts 16:14 Now a certain woman named Lydia heard us. She was a seller of purple from the city of Thyatira, who worshiped God. The Lord opened her heart to heed the things spoken by Paul.
Thank you PJ it sure doesnt seem like he does, he trys very hard to cunfuse spouting off scripture that doesnt seem to uphold anything he says, he does have me confused not about what I believe I have been a christian for may years but about what exactly he believes and how anyone could be so blind and to asume something like the world doesnt mean the whole world but just part of the world that God decided to chooses.. insanity I am so glad I am rooted and grounded in the word of God I may not be smart enough to spurt it out like that but it is written onmy heart as he promised he would do.. :applause: I like Donna she seems humble and sincere as I dont really understand what she believs either but Christ and Him crucified ans repentence of sin is all we need to get saved
Wait a sec??? James says that we do nothing to get saved?? but then he refers to repentence??? WOW I am confused now.. don t we have to d othe repenting or does God do that for us?? its madness and the bible says God is not the author of confusion.. what I believe is plain and clear the word doent need fuerther digging to get a basic understanding of what God was trying to say you dont need a degree in theology to understand it if the holy spirit guids you
