Author	Thread: purpose of salvation
dljrn04 View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 16 Nov, 2012 06:38 AM To say that God the Father has purposed the salvation of all mankind, that God the Son died with the express intention of saving the whole human race, and that God the Holy Spirit is now seeking to win the world to Christ; when, as a matter of common observation, it is apparent that the great majority of our fellow-men are dying in sin, and passing into a hopeless eternity: is to say that God the Father is disappointed, that God the Son is dissatisfied, and that God the Holy Spirit is defeated. A.W. Pink Post Reply
View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 25 Nov, 2012 07:16 AM What are Gods thoughts personally toward you, Ryan? How does He think of you? Post Reply
View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 25 Nov, 2012 07:23 AM He does. What I said was that John 3:16 is not accurately represented by your paraphrasing. First of all, "so" has nothing to do with quantity as most like to stress the "soooooo" when teaching it. I means, "in this way". John 3:16 tells us that God loved the world in this way, that He gave His son literally that "every believing one" would not perish but have everlasting life. The way in which God loved the world was to send His son to save the believing ones. That's what John 3:16 teaches. It's not this all encompassing cliche that most people try to throw out there. Post Reply
View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 25 Nov, 2012 07:26 AM So you are just going to ignore all of the verses and try to make this about me? How do you answer the scriptures. This is not about me. My point was that God didn't find some kind of inherent value in me that caused Him to save me over someone else. It was all done for His own name. Yes out of love, but for His own glory. Read the scriptures...the constant theme is God getting glory for Himself. Post Reply
View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 25 Nov, 2012 07:30 AM So God expressing His love toward us while we were yet sinners means what? Christ dieing for the ungodly means what? So what is the point in speading the Gospel if those chosen are just those chosen and the rest have no chance? Post Reply
View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 25 Nov, 2012 07:33 AM And do those chosen by God have no choice to be chosen by God. So they are chosen without any choice? Forced to be Gods? This sounds so impersonal and dictator like to me, doesnt it? Post Reply
View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 25 Nov, 2012 07:35 AM Why ask me? I just posted the verses. I will give my answer though. We are told to spread the gospel. We men on earth don't know who the chosen are, but God has chosen that His message will be heard by the elect through the preaching of the gospel. So we preach to all men, not knowing who will be saved and who will not. Let's take your view though. You still preach the gospel to men even though God knows that some will never believe in Him. What is the point in that? Why would God allow you to preach to those who have no hope? Your view isn't much different than mine in this regard. Mine is just more biblically accurate. Post Reply
View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 25 Nov, 2012 07:36 AM got to go for now. Post Reply
View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 25 Nov, 2012 07:38 AM "And do those chosen by God have no choice to be chosen by God. So they are chosen without any choice? Forced to be Gods? This sounds so impersonal and dictator like to me, doesnt it?" You tell me... 14 What shall we say then? Is there injustice on God's part? By no means! 15 For he says to Moses, �I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.� 16 So then it depends not on human will or exertion,[b] but on God, who has mercy. 17 For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, �For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I might show my power in you, and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.� 18 So then he has mercy on whomever he wills, and he hardens whomever he wills. 19 You will say to me then, �Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?� 20 But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, �Why have you made me like this?� 21 Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? 22 What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, 23 in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory These verses are true and we still know there is a personal God who is not simply a dictator. Just because you cannot reconcile it in your mind, does not mean it is not true. God doesn't force people against their will. He changes their will. It should be a think you are thankful for, as natural man would never choose God. Post Reply
View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 25 Nov, 2012 07:41 AM You know....it's the whole thing where you are given a new heart. Post Reply
View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 25 Nov, 2012 10:28 AM So then it depends not on human will or exertion,[b] but on God, who has mercy. Just to let you know I agree with predestination as well with free will. You see in Romans 15 it is speaking of ...God says He is not willing any should perish but ........It speaks of the will of God concerning the plan of salvation. It is not based on any plan or willingness of man but this does not leave out the will of man for believing Gods plan. Can you see the difference? Salvation is according to Gods will but in response to Gods will for us to be saved we resond according to our will toward His will for us. Election and predestination are not seperate but joined in the relationship betwen fallen humans and a loving God. If you choose to believe predestination alone that is fine as well. But I am solid on my belief. How you interpet scripture with scripture and how I do are from varing vantage points and such is life. Post Reply

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