Thread: The History of the Five Points Calvinism- The Synod of Dort...
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The History of the Five Points Calvinism- The Synod of Dort...
Posted : 23 Aug, 2011 03:44 PM
The History of the Five Points
This view of the sovereignty of God in salvation is often stated in five main points, which are known as �The Five Points of Calvinism.� Now, Calvin did not actually write about these five points as being the sum of his thought on soteriology. You will never find a pamphlet entitled, �My Five
Points by John Calvin.� The five points came to fruition after Calvin�s death.
John Calvin�s successor at Geneva was Theodore Beza. Beza was a gifted teacher and theologian who heartily carried on Calvin�s work at Geneva. Beza had a student named Jacobus Arminius (1560-1609). After completing his time of training in Geneva, Arminius took a position in Holland in 1603. At this time he as a strict Calvinist. However, while in Holland, Arminius faced stiff opposition to Calvin�s teachings. While he was defending attacks on Calvin�s teachings, Arminius was
persuaded to criticize certain aspects of John Calvin�s teaching. Arminius still considered himself a Calvinist, for indeed, he still held to many of Calvin�s views.
However, Arminius disagreed with Calvin�s soteriology.
Arminius wanted to revise some of the creeds of the church to fit his new theological views, but he died in 1609 before he was able to accomplish this. In the following year, Arminius�s followers, known as Arminians, drew up their own creed. This creed was based upon five key points of disagreement that Arminius had with Calvinism. The Arminians embraced much of Calvinism, but they objected to these five points. Their creed is known as the Remonstrance (disagreement or
protest).
Calvin�s followers, the Calvinists, objected to the teaching of the Remonstrance. They responded with the Counter-Remonstrance. Eventually, the Calvinists held a council to refute the Remonstrance.
The Calvinists met in Dort from 1618-1619. This meeting is commonly called the Synod of Dort. During this meeting, the Calvinists produced a response to the Remonstrance. Since
the Remonstrance was centered on five key points of disagreement with Calvinism, the Calvinists produced a five-fold response. This response is known as the Canons of Dort. The five points that the Canons of Dort articulate have come to be called �the five points of Calvinism.� So, �the five
points of Calvinism� are not a summary of Calvin�s teaching. They are not something that Calvin devised. The five points arose as a response to the Arminians� objections to Calvinism.
Related Historical Views
The debate over depravity, predestination, election, etc., did not begin in the 16th century with Calvinists and Arminians. Rather, this is an on-going debate that has surfaced at various times in church history.
Augustine and Pelagius - The original debate began in the 4th century between Augustine and Pelagius. Augustine held to
what we today call �Calvinism.� Actually, Calvin was most influenced by Augustine. He learned predestination from Augustine.
Pelagius objected to Augustine�s teachings. Augustine taught that man was depraved. Pelagiustaught that man was good. Adam fell, but this did not really affect his seed, except to set a bad example. Augustine spent much energy refuting Pelagius. Eventually, Pelagius lost because Pelagianism is not compatible with the teachings of the Bible.
However, some who were sentimental to Pelagius�s teachings modified his position. They said that man was fallen, but not so far that he couldn�t pick himself back up. This became known as Semi-Pelagianism. This is basically equivalent to Arminianism.
The History of the Five Points Calvinism- The Synod of Dort...
Posted : 23 Aug, 2011 05:06 PM
James replies:
Thank you for that article ET. That was true, and balanced, and gives a lot of good points on the actual history.
It was also short, which is important for people on this group.
I am a Christian, and I am Reformed. All I can do is show that what I believe is believed by theologians today, the puritans and the Reformers, and before them theologians in the middle ages, and before that the Early church fathers, and right back to what the Bible says.
You may disagree, but remember that Reformed theology, and a small part of it nicknamed Calvinism or the Doctrines of Grace, have a TON of verses that support it.
Now, back to the article, I have a Christian discussion group, and full on pelagians are not even allowed on the group.
Those are people who just think Adam was a bad example, and Jesus was a good example, and we can save ourselves by trying to be like Jesus. That is not even Christianity.
But I have to allow semi-pelagians, because that is what most American Christians are today.
Semi-pelagianism is Arminianism.
How do you know if you are an Arminian?
Do you believe that non-Christians can repent and trust in Jesus on their own free will?
Do you believe that God only writes peoples names in the book of life because He saw that in the future they would have faith?
Do you believe that Jesus died for everyone?
Do you believe that God's grace can be resisted?
If you believe those four things, you ARE an Arminian.
(Now, Arminians have always been divided on the question of whether or not a True Christian can lose their salvation, so either way on that question, and you are still an Arminian.)
ALL five points were considered and studied intensely by the councils, and after much study, ALL five points were rejected, because no Scripture supported ANY of the five points of the Arminians.
What Arminians have are a bunch of wrong presuppositions about Scripture, and the "all" and "world" verses and that is IT!
What Calvinists have are long lists of Scripture that back up each point.
A basic assumption of Arminians is that punishment and reward make no sense unless someone is morally able to choose either good or evil. They suppose that it is unfair to condemn someone if they were unable to do good. And they figure no one deserves to be rewarded if they were unable to fail. However, The Bible�s teachings are in stark contrast to this idea.
God is unable to lie, yet He still deserves praise for His truth. God is unable to sin, yet He still deserves to be praised for His holiness and righteousness. Therefore, God deserves praise because of His nature, not because of His ability. God does not have free will to sin!
Free will is not necessary to be praised, and it is NOT necessary for a sinful man to be condemned!
The History of the Five Points Calvinism- The Synod of Dort...
Posted : 23 Aug, 2011 06:35 PM
Calvin wrote
Institutes of the Christian Religion in 1536 (in Latin).
In it are his Five Points (T.U.L.I.P.)
Calvin did not label them his �Five Points� but they were there. You are correct when you say that the �Label� (Five Points) did not come to be until later when�Calvinists had to �counter claims of HERESY from other Christians and thus came about the Canons of Dort.
You are using Semantics here�it matters not when Calvin�s New Gospel was given an �Official Name��what matters is this New Gospel.
It also concerns me that you defend this �theology��Ella. You claim not to be a Calvinist�yet you defend it?
I do want to point out where you are getting your �information�.
Ella got this information from a church website (Christ Covenant Sunday School). Here is the website
The History of the Five Points Calvinism- The Synod of Dort...
Posted : 23 Aug, 2011 08:36 PM
The History of the Five Points Calvinism- The Synod of Dort... Posted : 23 Aug, 2011 06:35 PM
Arch said: Calvin wrote Institutes of the Christian Religion in 1536 (in Latin). In it are his Five Points (T.U.L.I.P.) Calvin did not label them his �Five Points� but they were there. You are correct when you say that the �Label� (Five Points) did not come to be until later when�Calvinists had to �counter claims of HERESY from other Christians and thus came about the Canons of Dort. You are using Semantics here�it matters not when Calvin�s New Gospel was given an �Official Name��what matters is this New Gospel. It also concerns me that you defend this �theology��Ella. You claim not to be a Calvinist�yet you defend it?
Ella says: Arch there is nothing, NOT ONE THING that says I am defending Calvinist theology, and you have no claim or charge to say otherwise. So don't even go there with me speaking what YOU think I am defending.. everybidy n this forum know where I stand with Calvinsims and Arminiansim, I am into Jesusim. I follow no man and his theology, only the Doctrne of Jesus Christ. And in case of you don't what the doctrine of Jeus Christ is, it is the teaching God had spoken concerning His Birth, His death, His burial, and His resurrection... nothing by the cross. So can't speak what I believe for me, speak those things you know for certain about my beliefs now that I have told you.
Arch said: I do want to point out where you are getting your �information�.Ella got this information from a church website (Christ Covenant Sunday School). Here is the website
Ella says: You can only point out what I have posted in this article, so only speak about what you have in front of you... I say to you :applause: VERY GOOD ARCH, you went in search for information for yourself and found the article. Very good job:applause:...I'm proud of you!:applause:... maybe now you have learned how to do reseacrh and find what it is you seek, and have learned how to READ!
Arch said: What Ella FAILED to include (which seems to be TYPICAL of those that �Follow� John Calvin is what was written earlier in this PDF. Allow me: �John Calvin was such an influential pastor and theologian that his views became a major system of theology known as �Calvinism.� Originally, the label Calvinism was applied to the entire body of Calvin�s theology, but today, Calvinism is used almost exclusively to refer his views on salvation or soteriology (soter = salvation). Thus, one can disagree with Calvin on any number of issues, but so long as he agrees with Calvin on soteriology, he is called a Calvinist.�
Ella says: NO, I didn't FAIL TO INCLUDE this information you've posted, I NVER PLANNED ON INCLDUIGN THIS INFORMATION... because my sole intent was to post ONLY the HISTORY part of the article, and only this as stated from the article ONLY. My purpose for doing such is, because there are those who think Calvin wrote the Five Points , and I wanted to post the history information which made it very clear that he DID NOT write the five points.... it was written by his followers who countered what Arminians had written... trust me, Arch, if you had the understanding that you think you have, you would be spiritually insightfully dangerous!:zzzz::laugh:
I posted no more than what I posted, and that was the History part.. plus, the article was too long for you to read, remember you don't like reading, so at least you read enough to find what you were seeking. PRAISE THE LORD...:glow::applause:
The History of the Five Points Calvinism- The Synod of Dort...
Posted : 23 Aug, 2011 09:41 PM
Ella,
How can you state that Calvin did not write the Five Points when it is so Clearly Stated in his 'Institutes' and you can see his Influence in The Westminister Confessions!
You use Semantics. Yes they were not called "The Five Points" until later...but how can you DENY that they are Calvin's Very Words? That they are his theology?
Also Ella...when you make claims...you should Expect others to want to see and verify the Veracity of what you say. If you speak the Truth...you would welcome imspection...why do you "hide" this from us?
Truth is Calvinism bears his name because it is his theology.
There are Millions that believe this New Gospel and many others that believe it yet "claim" that they are Not Calvinists.
The History of the Five Points Calvinism- The Synod of Dort...
Posted : 23 Aug, 2011 10:05 PM
Arch, I don't have a clue as to what you are talking about, and I don't think you do either. I would suggest you go to the top of the thread and READ the article carefully.
You are arguing by yourself about something that I'm not involved in... I make no claims so where are you coming up with all of this... so take your time and READ what the AUTHOR of this article says... think about what is written... then speak.:goofball:
The History of the Five Points Calvinism- The Synod of Dort...
Posted : 23 Aug, 2011 10:27 PM
Ella,
I fear that Bi-Polarism is spreading!
Did not the article you posted in this Thread have in it:
"Now, Calvin did not actually write about these five points as being the sum of his thought on soteriology. You will never find a pamphlet entitled, �My Five
Points by John Calvin.� The five points came to fruition after Calvin�s death."
That is what I am refering to.
You "feigning" ignorance does not excuse you.
I ask again...how can you state that when every Piece of Evidence and History Says Otherwise?
The History of the Five Points Calvinism- The Synod of Dort...
Posted : 23 Aug, 2011 11:06 PM
Arch said: Ella, I fear that Bi-Polarism is spreading!
Ella says: Yes, I too, am afraid bi-polarism is spreading as well... Arch, make sure you take precautions, I think I read somewhere that new research says it can be catching...:ROFL::excited::laugh:...
Arch, you're too funny, hostle but funny:ROFL::laugh:
The History of the Five Points Calvinism- The Synod of Dort...
Posted : 24 Aug, 2011 06:25 AM
THE **CALLED** THE **CHOSEN** AND THE **FAITHFUL
Romans 8:28-39: "We know that all things God works for the good of those who love Him, who:rolleyes: have been called according to His purpose. For those God foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the likeness of His Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those He predestined, He also called; those He called He also justified; those He justified, He also glorified.
What, then, shall we say in response to this? If God is for us:rolleyes:, who can be against us? He who did not spare His own Son, but gave Him up for us all--how will He not also , along with him, graciously give us all things?Who will bring any charge against those whom God has chosen? It is God who justifies. Who is he who condemns? Christ Jesus, who died--more than that who was raised to life--is at the right hand of God and is also interceding for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall trouble or hardship or persecution or famine or nakedness or danger or sword?...
No in all these things we:rolleyes: are more then conquerors through Him who loved us. For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels or demons, neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us form the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord.":applause:
John 6:39,44: Jesus says, "This is the will of Him who sent Me, that I shall ****LOSE NONE**** of all that He has given Me, but raise them up on the Last Day...No one can come to Me **UNLESS* the Father who sent Me draws him, and I will raise him up at the Last Day!":applause:
John 1:13,14: To all who received Him {Jesus}..He gave the right to became children of God--children born not of natural descent, nor of *HUMAN DECISION** or of a husband's will, but BORN OF GOD!":angel:
Ephesians 2:6-10: And God {The Father} raised us up with Him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, in order that in the coming ages He might show the incomparable riches of His grace, expressed in His kindness to us in Christ Jesus. For it is be *GRACE* {Unmerited favor} you have been saved, through faith--and this **NOT FROM YOURSELVES**, it is the {100%} *GIFT* of God--**NOT BY WORKS**, so that no one can boast. For we are God's workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do!"
There will be two comings of Jesus on the same Last Day. The first will be **FOR** His saints and the second will be **WITH** His saints just after the Marriage Feast of the Lamb as per Revelation 19:8-20 and Revelation 17:14 "They will make war against the Lamb, but the Lamb will overcome them because He is Lord of lords and King of kings-- and **WITH HIM*:rolleyes: will be His **CALLED **, **CHOSEN** and **FAITHFUL** followers!!":applause:
God only *CALLS** and CHOOSES** those He knows will be **FAITHFUL**.
Matthew 13:18-23: Jesus says, "Listen to what the parable of the sower means: When anyone hears the message about the kingdom and does not understand it {Such as all Roman Catholics}, the evil one comes and snatches away what was sown in his heart. This is the seed sown along the path. The one who received the seed that fell on rocky places is the man who hears the Word and at once receives it with joy: But since he has no root, he lasts only a short time. When trouble or persecution {See Matt 24:9-13} comes because of the Word, he quickly falls away.
The one who received the seed that fell among the thorns is the man who hears the Word, but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth {The Prosperity Gospel} choke it making it unfruitful. But the one who received the seed that fell on good soil is the man who hears the Word and understands it. He produces a crop, yielding a hundred, sixty or thirty times what was sown!"
He is one of the **CALLED**, **CHOSEN** and **FAITHFUL**!!:angel: It is interesting that ONLY the **CALLED**, **CHOSEN** and **FAITHFUL** will be WITH Jesus on the Last Day as per Revelation 17:14!!
