Author	Thread: Circumcision: A Shadow Returned As Fleshly Tradition
Admin	Circumcision: A Shadow Returned As Fleshly Tradition Posted : 18 Jun, 2012 10:39 AM Circumcision; A Shadow Returned As Fleshly Tradition I Googled "Circumcision Rates For Dispensationalist Denominations." One of the links was for www. theologyonline.com, a Christian forum. I had no idea what to expect from such a search topic. My hypothesis is that one, and only one of several reasons why circumcision has continued as a routine operation on newborn male babies in the U.S., is that dispensationalism honors physical Israel of the Old Covenant. Therefore, circumcision as a mark of identity of Jewish males might be considered by dispensationalists to be desirable, knowing it is now of no spiritual importance as an identity mark for Christians. But it is for Jews, in the eyes of most dispensationalists, whose belief that God has two peoples, the Jews and the church, implies strongly that All Israel remain God's chosen people. This belief, including that circumcision is still a mark of belonging to God's chosen people, is contradicted by Romans 2: 28-29, Romans 9: 6-8 and Galatians 4: 25-26. That is, for dispensationalists, since circumcision would be seen as a desirable practice, even though it is no longer a mark of having an identity in God's chosen for Christians, the operation would be seen as having the benefits described by doctors who advocated routine infant circumcision in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. The doctors then claimed that it prevented masturbation, and diseases. The particular diseases they have claimed it prevents have changed and shrunk in number over the years. Now its cancer of the cervix and AIDS. The doctors who pushed for routine circumcision claimed it diminishes male sexual pleasure. They also over-generalized the hygiene benefits. In fact, dispensationalism teaches that All Israel, meaning all of physical Israel, including all who rejected Christ and all who continue to do so are the chosen people. They have given up their position in Christ as the chosen to All Israel, meaning all physical Israel. I Peter 2: 5 and 9 say "Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.... But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:" Routine infant circumcision under the Old Covenant was part of the ceremonial law, not part of the moral law. As such, it is a shadow of the substance of things to come, of Christ and his Gospel, Hebrews 10: 1 and Colossians 2: 17 discuss the shadows of the substance which as to come. "Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ." Colossians 2: 16-17 As a shadow of things to come the New Testament does not deal in an explicit way with exactly what circumcision points to under the New Covenant and in the Gospel. Hebrews 9: 22 says "And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission." A relatively small amount of blood is shed by the type of circumcision performed under the Old Covenant. Medical circumcision is much more of a mutilation of the human body, and more bloody. We might say that it points to a dying to the flesh and a rebirth in the Spirit. Circumcision as Genesis 17: 11 says "ye shall circumcise the flesh of your (censored for CDFF)..." points to a dying to the flesh and a rebirth in the Spirit. But "flesh" means more than the human body; it means dying to self, to all the desires, feelings and opinions of the self, lust, anger, anxiety, fear, jealousy, pride. As a metaphor, circumcision looks toward the Christian becoming the son of God, inspired by the Holy Spirit and lifted out of the flesh into the Spirit. "And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:" Ephesians 2: 6 As a shadow, a metaphor for rising out of the physical, the flesh, circumcision is not to be in the literal flesh of male Christians. In fact, those who are in Christ can sit in heaven now with him, even though they may be uncircumcised in their literal flesh. "Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge." Hebrews 13:4 Circumcision in the Bible is not recommended as a mutilation to diminish the male's sexual desire within that permanent heterosexual relationship structure God ordained which is called marriage in Scripture. In Phillipians 3:2 the Greek word translated as concision, Strong's number 2699, katatome, is said to mean "a cutting down, or cutting off, i.e, mutilation. "Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the concision." Phillipians 3: 2 "Ye are the children of the LORD your God: ye shall not cut yourselves, nor make any baldness between your eyes for the dead. 2. for thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God, and the LORD hath chosen thee to be a peculiar people unto himself, above all the nations that are upon the earth." Deuteronomy 14: 1-2 The command of the moral law not to cut the human body can be generalized to the mutilation of Medical circumcision. Old Covenant circumcision did not mutilate but a very small tip as part of the human male reproductive organ. Christian believers who are he elect are Israel reborn in Christ, a spiritual house, and are a holy people. This goes on and probably would not be read by many here. In addition, when showing that modern medical circumcision is not the same procedure used under the Old Covenant the word for the anatomy removed is censored by Christian Dating For Free. if anyone wants to read the longer part go to: http://halfback.inube.com/blog/1422462/circumcision-a-shadow-returning-as-fleshly-tradition/ Post Reply
View Profile History	Circumcision: A Shadow Returned As Fleshly Tradition Posted : 20 Jun, 2012 03:47 AM Because a form of circumcision was the mark of being a member of God's chosen people under the Old Covenant, and because it is still practiced as a medical procedure in the United States, it is a good topic to show how so many Christians start from wrong assumptions and beliefs. Circumcision of males is still done by most Islamic nations, in addition to Jews worldwide. But the rest of the world, including Europe, does not engage in routine infant medical circumcision. The question is why has the U.S. continued the practice when rates of circumcision for the other English speaking countries - Canada, Australia, England - have dropped way below ours since the early or mid 20th century. These English speaking nations were once protestant in culture and also influenced by the theology called dispensationalism. The theology had its origin in England, though it took root in the U.S. during the late 19th and early 20th centuries. Not only is the assumption of many, or most, Christians that circumcision under the Old Covenant was the same as Pharisaic circumcision started in about 140 A.D. and medical circumcision, wrong, but the basic teachings of dispensationalism are also wrong, when compared to scripture. John 3: 1-6 says Nicodemus, a Pharisee, had to be born again to enter into the kingdom of God. Those of physical Israel had to be born again to get into the kingdom, or be saved. God as Christ, the dresser in the parable of the vineyard of Luke 13: 6-9, asked the Father to allow him to give Israel one more chance. That one more chance was to be the transformation of physical Israel from reliance on that which is physical - circumcision, a literal blood line from Abraham, a temple building and all the shadows of the ceremonial law pointing to Christ - to a spiritual house (I Peter 2: 5-9). Paul's difficult metaphoric 11th chapter in Romans, using the good olive tree, says those of physical Israel who rejected Christ were broken off and former Gentiles who believed were grafted in to the branches or trunk. Christ himself has to be the root of the good olive tree; it cannot be the religion of the Pharisees of the first century, or any other form of apostasy of physical Israel. The good olive tree is not Old Covenant Israel even as a remnant who were in faith, though that believing remnant is one with us in faith. The good olive tree is that transformed Israel which Christ as the dresser was to create with himself as the sacrifice. Paul in Romans 2: 28-29, Romans 9: 6-8, and in Galatians 4: 25-26 teaches that in the transformation of physical Israel, mentioned as early as II Kings 21: 13, and carried on in Isaiah 29: 16, pointing to Jeremiah 18: 1-6, the real Jew became an inward Jew of any race, physical Israel by virtue of their descent from Abraham are just the children of the flesh if they reject Christ, and all who accept Christ belong to that Jerusalem which is above, is free and is the mother of us all. In Romans 4: 13-14, and especially in Galatians 3: 16-29 Paul explains how in that transformation of Israel physical descent from Abraham was replaced by taking on the faith of Abraham in Christ. After the transformation people of any race could be in Christ. "If ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise. He shows in the verse before this that being Jews or Gentiles makes no difference, because all in Christ are one, In Matthew 23: 38, after saying that the Pharisees are serpents and vipers, and how those in physical Israel killed the prophets he sent to them, Christ says to physical Israel, "Behold, your house is left unto you desolate." In Matthew 8: 12 Christ says the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness. Finally, Christ says in John 10: 16 that there shall be one fold and one shepherd, not two folds, the Jews and the "church" as the theology of dispensationalism teaches. The New Testament does not spoon feed the unwise virgins (Matthew 25: 1-12) who have been taught on the milk rather than the meat and are in false doctrines. What all the scriptures quoted above mean is that there is one saved group of people of God, not two, and that saved group has to be Israel, but not physical Israel. Christ was sent to save Israel, not a meeting, an assembly, a congregation (ekklesia), or to allow All Israel to be saved because of their blood line from Abraham as the second and superior group of God's people. Physical Israel was not replaced by the capital C church. It was changed in Christ from a physical house to a spiritual house. The shadows of the Old Covenant pointing to the substance which is Christ were done away with. But the moral law in the five books of Moses was not done away with. It is a vital part of the Gospel because it shows us our sin. Post Reply