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New Covenant or Renewed covenant
Posted : 19 Nov, 2011 05:33 AM

Hello everyone:



First the last two topic postings were not completed as i had hit the enter by way of brain interference.



Now is the NEW COVENANT completely new,or is this covenant just the old covenant having been 'RENEWED,as someone has stated.



'We are called in the new testement under the renewd covenant (which means same covenant refreahed and fullfilled)'



Shalom

Me

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elishabroadway

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New Covenant or Renewed covenant
Posted : 19 Nov, 2011 07:24 AM

You are so quick to look up words, why dont you do a google search on the word now in the greek I thinks its strongs g2537

then you will see what the word means, and Jesus said he did not come to abolish the law but to fullfill it! Thats pretty plain!

Obeying Gods law is critical its part of repentence, if you turn from sin then you will obey because sin is disobedience.. huh that means if faith is obedience then sin is oposit of faith which means you cant do both!! You cant have faith and still live in your sinful state!

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New Covenant or Renewed covenant
Posted : 19 Nov, 2011 07:27 AM

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New Covenant OR Covenant Renewd/ AMEN OR OH ME?

Posted : 16 Nov, 2011 10:54 PM





Introduction



Our understanding of the Bible is loaded down with many wrong concepts that in reality fracture our relationship with God. In particular our search for an easy way to gain entry into eternity is fraught with failure and even Jesus warned against it when he said: -







Matthew 7:13-14: - 13"Enter by the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is easy, that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. 14For the gate is narrow and the way is hard, that leads to life, and those who find it are few.







The �New Covenant� theology is one such way we look for an easy way into heaven. We say that the �Law� no longer applies to us and that we are under grace but even that �grace� has boundary conditions. For example, Jesus taught a number of times that, �unless you can forgive, then God cannot forgive you.�[1] That is conditional and is a boundary condition for our righteous and entry into eternity with the Lord.







Jesus also stated: -







Matthew 5:17-18: - 17"Think not that I have come to abolish the law and the prophets; I have come not to abolish them but to fulfil them. 18For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the law until all is accomplished.







Because the Israelites did not fully grasp God�s grace of redemption, He spelt out the boundary conditions that applied for them and these boundary conditions were used by the �righteous� people among the Israelites to determine their acceptance to the Lord and so the �Law� was entrenched into their psyche as their means of entering into �heaven�.







Jesus actually applied a stricter code of behaviour than was contained within the Mount Sinai revelation of the Law and its expansion by the Scribes and Pharisees. For example:







In Matthew 5:21-22[2]Jesus taught two aspects about killing a person:



that holding enraged anger against our brother is equivalent to actually killing him which is why we should never let the sun go down when we are angry but that we should quickly forgive our brother lest we are found guilty of our sin, and



that considering your brother as foolish, [which from a Biblical perspective is to consider that the person is walking contrary to God], without attempting to encouraging him to repent and return to God is equivalent to physically killing him because we condemned him to death and did nothing to save him we ourselves will be found guilty of killing that person.[3]



In Matthew 5:27-28[4]Jesus taught that the lustful desire of a woman was also adultery and was just as sinful as the physical act of adultery with the woman.



As such he pointed out that the Law still applied but that God�s expectations were such that it would only be by His Grace that we would be able to keep the �Law.�







Yes God�s love for us is unconditional in that he �Loved us so much that he sent his only begotten son to dies for us so that whoever believes in him will be saved[5]







Let us now consider the references to the �new covenant.�







References to �New Covenant� in the Bible



The following references refer to the �New Covenant� in the English translations. The author has also provided his translation for these same References to reflect what he believes is the true position of God on this matter.







Qualification



Just as the theological understanding of the Bible translators influenced the translation outcomes for each of the translators and the translation versions, I also must not let my theological understanding determine the way I would translate the original Hebrew and Greek versions of the Bible otherwise I will display the same error as they have.







Wherever possible I have attempted to allow the context of the original text to uncover the English translation that I have suggested. Given that I am fallible, I trust that I have provided a better translation and understanding of the references quoted below.







Old Testament References



Jeremiah 31:31-34: -



31"Behold, the days[6]are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new[7] covenantwith the house of Israel and the house of Judah, 32not like the covenant which I made with their fathers when I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, my covenant which they broke, though I was their husband, says the LORD. 33But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put my law within them, and I will write it upon their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.[8] 34And no longer shall each man teach his neighbour and each his brother, saying, `Know the LORD,' for they shall all know me, from the least of them to the greatest, says the LORD; for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more."







A better translation of verse 31, which the Jewish scholars also hold too, is: -







Behold the day is coming says the lord when I will make the covenant like new with the house of Israel and the House of Judah







A better translation of verse 33a, which follows on from verse 31, is: -







But this is the covenant which I will remakewith the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD:







The fulfilment of Jeremiah 31:31-34



The question that has to be answered is, �When will this prophecy be fulfilled?�







The author�s understanding is that this prophecy is still to be fulfilled and that it will happen after Jesus� second return to earth to rule as the Messianic king. Jesus himself hinted at this in Luke 14:31-33, when he claimed that the Jewish people would seek his terms of peace[9]when he returns as the conquering king[10]in the future. But before that can happen, the children and the children�s children must suffer the iniquity of the fore fathers during the third and fourth age of Israel. At the start of the fifth age of Israel Jesus will return and the Lord will renew his covenant with the House of Judah and Israel.







New Testament References



Introduction



Most of the references to the �new� covenant in the following New Testament passages have been translated from the Greek word �kainh�{{kaine�}, which has the meaning of �made new� or �refreshed�. Of the forty-five times that Strong�s NT2537 is found in the New Testament, the Author has only identified six instances where it is directly associated with the word �covenant�







There are only twenty-three references to the Greek word �>ne/a$� {n�as}, which has the meaning of �brand new�, in the New Testament and of these only 1 is associated with the word �covenant/testament�.







To highlight this distinction between ne/on {brand new} and kainou/$ {made like new/renewed} in the New Testament we only have to refer to the following one verse parable:







Matthew 9:17: -Neither is [brand] new wine put into old wineskins; if it is, the skins burst, and the wine is spilled, and the skins are destroyed; but new wine {ne/on} is put into [re]fresh[ed] {kainou/$} wineskins, and so both are preserved."







Even the word �new� in our own expressive usage has to be qualified. For example: -







the statement, �This is my new car.� Could be understood to mean either,







� �This is my {brand} new car.� Or







� �This is my new {second hand} car.�







So it is with the Greek Bible, we have to consider the circumstances and context of the language used for the word and the modifiers used in conjunction with the word. Our understanding of the �new Covenant� is just one example of that.







References



1 Matthew 26:27-28: - {blank}



And he took a cup, and when he had given thanks he gave it to them, saying, "Drink of it, all of you; for this is my blood of the {new} covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins







The expression �new covenant� is not found in all English translation of the Bible for this passage and is not present in the Greek Translation of the New Testament. It has been added to some translations to reflect the Theological understanding of the translators of that time.







2 Mark 14:24-25: - {blank}



And he said to them, "This is my blood of the {new} covenant, which is poured out for many.







The expression �new covenant� is not found in all English translation of the Bible for this passage and is not present in the Greek Translation of the New Testament. It has been added to some translations to reflect the Theological understanding of the translators of that time.







3 Luke 22:20: - [kainh]}



And likewise the cup after supper, saying, "This cup which is poured out for you is the new covenant[11] in my blood.







Again the word �new� as translated here should be �made new� As Jesus came initially for the Jewish people. A better translation for me is: -







�This cup which is poured out for you is the covenant made new [refreshed] in my blood.







4 1 Corinthians 11:25: - [ kainh]}



In the same way also the cup, after supper, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in my blood. Do this, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of me."







Again for me the better translation is: -







�This cup is the covenant made new in my blood�







5 2 Corinthians 3:6: - [kainh=$]



who has made us competent to be ministers of a new covenant, not in a written code but in the Spirit; for the written code kills, but the Spirit gives life.







The same argument can be mad here: -







�Who made us competent to be ministers of the covenant made new,�







6 Hebrews 8:8: - [kainh/n]



For he finds fault with them when he says:







"The days will come, says the Lord,







when I will establish a new covenantwith the house of Israel







and with the house of Judah;







This verse is a reference to Jeremiah 31:31 and a better translation based on the Greek word �kainh/n� is







The days will come, says the Lord,







when I will make with the house of Israel







and with the house of Judah







a renewed covenant;







7 Hebrews 8:13: ["Kainhn"]



In speaking of a new {covenant}[12]he treats the first as obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.







A better translation of this verse is: -







In speaking of a �renewed� [covenant]he treats the former as obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.







To understand this verse we should consider the following parable: -







A man and a woman enter into a marriage covenant and after a number of years the woman leaves the man and goes to live in another house. The man loves his wife very much and he does not devoice her but he wisely begins to court his wife and to draw her back. After a period of time the husband and the wife reconcile the relationship and the wife once more appreciates and loves her husband. When the man and the woman begin to live again as husband and wife they renew their marriage covenant which they had made initially, but the renewed marriage covenant they made was slightly different from their previous covenant.







As the years passed the former marriage covenant they had made became obsolete and the renewed marriage covenant came to the for in their lives.[13]







Confirming Old Testament scripture passages:-



Isaiah 54:5-8 5 For your Maker is your husband,







the LORD of hosts is his name;







and the Holy One of Israel is your Redeemer,







the God of the whole earth he is called.







6For the LORD has called you







like a wife forsaken and grieved in spirit,







like a wife of youth when she is cast off,







says your God.







7 For a brief moment I forsook you,







but with great compassion I will gather you.















8 In overflowing wrath for a moment







I hid my face from you,















but with everlasting love I will have compassion on you,







says the LORD, your Redeemer.







Hosea 2:16-20: - 16"And in that day, says the LORD, you will call me, `My husband,' and no longer will you call me, `My Baal.' 17For I will remove the names of the Baals from her mouth, and they shall be mentioned by name no more. 18And I will make for you a covenant on that day with the beasts of the field, the birds of the air, and the creeping things of the ground; and I will abolish the bow, the sword, and war from the land; and I will make you lie down in safety. 19 And I will betroth you to me forever; I will betroth you to me in righteousness and in justice, in steadfast love, and in mercy. 20I will betroth you to me in faithfulness; and you shall know the LORD.







8 Hebrews 9:15: - [kainh=$]



Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred which redeems them from the transgressions under the first covenant.







A better understanding of the this verse is gained if it is translated as: -







And for this reason He is the Mediator of the covenant made new, by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions under the first testament/covenant, that those who are called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance.







9 Hebrews 12:24: - [ne/a$]



and to Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks more graciously than the blood of Abel.







The word �new� here is translated from �neo� which has the meaning of �brand new� and this is the only time it is found in a verse in the New Testament where the word covenant is also found in close proximity. A better translation is: -







�And to Jesus the newmediator of the covenant, ��







Conclusion



The references quoted above suggest that there has been no �new� covenant undertaking by God and that the language used in the Bible confirms this understanding. Jesus himself, as quoted by the New Testament writers, did not state that he was ushering in a new covenant but that he was fulfilling the existing covenant and Law that had previously been written by Moses and the Prophets.







We cannot claim that the Law has been done away with, only that the Law has been fulfilled through Christ�s first visitation here on earth.







We cannot claim that the Law no longer applies to us because of a supposed �New Covenant� which we claim has done away with the Law if no �New Covenant� has been established.







As such the Law still applies but God enables us to keep the Law through his grace as we rely on Him to help us to comply with the Law, as we are unable to keep the Law in our own strength.







As we believe in Him whom he has sent and continue to receive his grace so we are made whole and acceptable and are judges as righteous like Abraham and become of his seed.

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New Covenant or Renewed covenant
Posted : 19 Nov, 2011 08:59 AM

Hi elisha:

Love what you do with your hair.





English-New



Greek-kainos



καινός

kainos

Thayer Definition:

1) new

1a) as respects form

1a1) recently made, fresh, recent, unused, unworn

1b) as respects substance

1b1) of a new kind, unprecedented, novel, uncommon, unheard of

Part of Speech: adjective

A Related Word by Thayer�s/Strong�s Number: of uncertain affinity





Mat_26:28 ForG1063 thisG5124 isG2076 myG3450 bloodG129 of(G3588) theG3588 newG2537 testament,G1242 which is shedG1632 forG4012 manyG4183 forG1519 the remissionG859 of sins.G266





Having a persons sin(s) completely removed would be NEW to the Hebrews,for under the Old Covenant their sin(s) were 'COVERED' by the blood of animals.



Only in Yeshua is a persons sin(s) 'COMPLETELY and UTTERLY REMOVED' from the face of YHWH and from the person themselves.



Heb 10:16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;

Heb 10:17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.





kainos: new, fresh

Original Word: καινός, ή, όν

Part of Speech: Adjective

Transliteration: kainos

Phonetic Spelling: (kahee-nos')

Short Definition: fresh, new

Definition: fresh, new, unused, novel.







2537 kain�s � properly, new in quality (innovation), fresh in development or opportunity � because "not found exactly like this before."





Word Origin

a prim. word

Definition

new, fresh

NASB Word Usage

fresh (3), new (37), new things (1), things new (1).



NAS Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible with Hebrew-Aramaic and Greek Dictionaries

Copyright � 1981, 1998 by The Lockman Foundation

All rights reserved Lockman.org



new.



Of uncertain affinity; new (especially in freshness; while neos is properly so with respect to age -- new.



see GREEK neos





The NEW COVENANT is a Covenant which is COMPLETELY NEW,

This Covenant had been alluded to in the Old Covenant through the blood of animals sacrifices.

These sacrifices pointed to the blood of Yeshua, the Last and 'ONLY' sacrifice of YHWH, to forgive and completely remove the sin(s) of those trusting Yeshua to save them from the wrath of YHWH against their sin(s).





Shalom

Me

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New Covenant or Renewed covenant
Posted : 19 Nov, 2011 09:18 AM

George Whatever the status is you delected to Go the way of Cain, Have you not?

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New Covenant or Renewed covenant
Posted : 19 Nov, 2011 09:59 AM

Peej:



Love what you do with your hair.



Shalom

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New Covenant or Renewed covenant
Posted : 19 Nov, 2011 10:04 AM

That was not the question but it is a tactic of those that walk in the way of Cain.

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New Covenant or Renewed covenant
Posted : 19 Nov, 2011 10:19 AM

@ POC



:devil:

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Posted : 19 Nov, 2011 10:34 AM

Hey ange



I did not know that Yeshua shared with you His authority to make a judgement such as you have with your Satanic symbol.



Shame on you.



Also,where does the Scriptures says Satan has horns,a pointed tail and carrys a pitch fork.



Does not posiedon carry a pitch fork/trident.



Me

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Posted : 19 Nov, 2011 12:01 PM

Hebrews Chapter 9: The Old and the New Covenants Contrasted

Worship in the Earthly Tabernacle

1 Now the first covenant had regulations for worship and also an earthly sanctuary. A tabernacle was set up. In its first room were the lampstand and the table with its consecrated bread; this was called the Holy Place. Behind the second curtain was a room called the Most Holy Place, which had the golden altar of incense and the gold-covered ark of the covenant. This ark contained the gold jar of manna, Aaron�s staff that had budded, and the stone tablets of the covenant. Above the ark were the cherubim of the Glory, overshadowing the atonement cover. But we cannot discuss these things in detail now.

6 When everything had been arranged like this, the priests entered regularly into the outer room to carry on their ministry. But only the high priest entered the inner room, and that only once a year, and never without blood, which he offered for himself and for the sins the people had committed in ignorance. The Holy Spirit was showing by this that the way into the Most Holy Place had not yet been disclosed as long as the first tabernacle was still functioning. This is an illustration for the present time, indicating that the gifts and sacrifices being offered were not able to clear the conscience of the worshiper. They are only a matter of food and drink and various ceremonial washings�external regulations applying until the time of the new order.

The Blood of Christ

11 But when Christ came as high priest of the good things that are now already here, he went through the greater and more perfect tabernacle that is not made with human hands, that is to say, is not a part of this creation. He did not enter by means of the blood of goats and calves; but he entered the Most Holy Place once for all by his own blood, thus obtaining eternal redemption. The blood of goats and bulls and the ashes of a heifer sprinkled on those who are ceremonially unclean sanctify them so that they are outwardly clean. How much more, then, will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself unblemished to God, cleanse our consciences from acts that lead to death, so that we may serve the living God! For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance�now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.

16 In the case of a will, it is necessary to prove the death of the one who made it, because a will is in force only when somebody has died; it never takes effect while the one who made it is living. This is why even the first covenant was not put into effect without blood. When Moses had proclaimed every command of the law to all the people, he took the blood of calves, together with water, scarlet wool and branches of hyssop, and sprinkled the scroll and all the people. He said, �This is the blood of the covenant, which God has commanded you to keep.� In the same way, he sprinkled with the blood both the tabernacle and everything used in its ceremonies. In fact, the law requires that nearly everything be cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.

23 It was necessary, then, for the copies of the heavenly things to be purified with these sacrifices, but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. For Christ did not enter a sanctuary made with human hands that was only a copy of the true one; he entered heaven itself, now to appear for us in God�s presence. Nor did he enter heaven to offer himself again and again, the way the high priest enters the Most Holy Place every year with blood that is not his own. Otherwise Christ would have had to suffer many times since the creation of the world. But he has appeared once for all at the culmination of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself. Just as people are destined to die once, and after that to face judgment, so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.

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Posted : 19 Nov, 2011 12:11 PM

The Failure of the Old Covenant

Hebrews 10

Christ�s Sacrifice Once for All

1 The law is only a shadow of the good things that are coming�not the realities themselves. For this reason it can never, by the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship. 2 Otherwise, would they not have stopped being offered? For the worshipers would have been cleansed once for all, and would no longer have felt guilty for their sins. 3 But those sacrifices are an annual reminder of sins. 4 It is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins. Therefore, when Christ came into the world, he said: �Sacrifice and offering you did not desire, but a body you prepared for me; with burnt offerings and sin offerings you were not pleased. Then I said, �Here I am�it is written about me in the scroll� I have come to do your will, my God.�� First he said, �Sacrifices and offerings, burnt offerings and sin offerings you did not desire, nor were you pleased with them��though they were offered in accordance with the law. Then he said, �Here I am, I have come to do your will.� He sets aside the first to establish the second. And by that will, we have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

11 Day after day every priest stands and performs his religious duties; again and again he offers the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God, and since that time he waits for his enemies to be made his footstool. For by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy. The Holy Spirit also testifies to us about this. First he says: �This is the covenant I will make with them after that time, says the Lord. I will put my laws in their hearts, and I will write them on their minds.� Then he adds: �Their sins and lawless acts I will remember no more.�And where these have been forgiven, sacrifice for sin is no longer necessary.

A Call to Persevere in Faith

19 Therefore, brothers and sisters, since we have confidence to enter the Most Holy Place by the blood of Jesus, by a new and living way opened for us through the curtain, that is, his body, and since we have a great priest over the house of God, let us draw near to God with a sincere heart and with the full assurance that faith brings, having our hearts sprinkled to cleanse us from a guilty conscience and having our bodies washed with pure water. Let us hold unswervingly to the hope we profess, for he who promised is faithful. And let us consider how we may spur one another on toward love and good deeds, not giving up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but encouraging one another�and all the more as you see the Day approaching.

26 If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God. Anyone who rejected the law of Moses died without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. How much more severely do you think someone deserves to be punished who has trampled the Son of God underfoot, who has treated as an unholy thing the blood of the covenant that sanctified them, and who has insulted the Spirit of grace? For we know him who said, �It is mine to avenge; I will repay,� and again, �The Lord will judge his people.� It is a dreadful thing to fall into the hands of the living God. Remember those earlier days after you had received the light, when you endured in a great conflict full of suffering. Sometimes you were publicly exposed to insult and persecution; at other times you stood side by side with those who were so treated. You suffered along with those in prison and joyfully accepted the confiscation of your property, because you knew that you yourselves had better and lasting possessions. So do not throw away your confidence; it will be richly rewarded.

36 You need to persevere so that when you have done the will of God, you will receive what he has promised. For, �In just a little while, he who is coming will come and will not delay.� And, �But my righteous one will live by faith. And I take no pleasure in the one who shrinks back.� But we do not belong to those who shrink back and are destroyed, but to those who have faith and are saved.

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