Is Fallen Mankind capable of cooperating with God?
Posted : 21 Nov, 2011 09:07 PM
You are wrong James! I knew full well what the deal was when I was lost, the more I heard the word of God from my daddy and at church the more I understood. I was able in my unseaved state to explain very deep spiritual things and I had a great understanding! if you think I am being dishonest, ill give you my daddys email you can talk to him!
I had a great understanding, HOWEVER I WAS NOT READSY TO MAKE THE CHOICE TO LIVE FOR GOD!
You can take all the bible verses out of context that you want to , but they do not change what I have lived, no fallen man may not be able to fully understand the things of God but if he is exposed to the Word enough and sees Christians living as examples letting there lights shine out into a dark world, then they will begin to want what we have! And thats when God will break in on them!
You have got to rightly divide the word, its not just words on pages it is alive, the stors are not just storys they are types!
Like the children being lost in the wilderness and so many other things, these are not just great stories for sunday school they when read under the anointing of the Holy spirit are a way for us to understand God and hid plan! I am not smart enough to put everything into words like you , but God has written things on my heart, I know for sure I had a calling on my life, Gods hand was on me all along ,now I can see it but before I got saved I could not! that is an example of what the scriptures about natural man not understanding means! BUT if faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word then umm if someone hears enough then their faith will come if they will lay down their pride and love of this world and take up their cross and follow him! Jesus never said here i am forcing you to carry this cross and i am dragging you behind me now did he? No he did not, he said take up your cross and follow me! THAT IMPLYS AND ACTION ON OUR PART!!!!! that means there is something for us to do1
OK now check this out!!!
YOU say that when someone is the "ELECT" then the spirit comes alive in them and makes them get saved right?
But the HOLY SPIRIT could not come until after ajesus assended to heaven!!!!!
OK so then are you telling me that Moses, Abraham, OOOHHH ENOCH!! Enoch walked with God and was a freind of God and he was not for God took him (NOT WORD FOR WORD BUT CLOSE) ok he was so close to God that he diodnt even die, God tookl him up to heaven what abou Noah and Job and elijah.. I mean the holy spirit wasnt even sent yet, right? Jesus sent him on he day of pentecost.. So how did these fallen natural men manage to be such great men of God? I dont even care if you answer, I already know you have an answer that someone else has washed your brain with!!!! Too bad when people get brain washed their brains dont stay clean! NO they wont be happy with just a washed brain thats good and clean!!! NOPE they got to dirty it up again with lies and twists and turns and half truths! I am disgusted with this gobeldy gook! the word of God is not really something that is to be twisted and interpreted! I mean for real! what kind of big loops and circles are yall gonna make to prove to me that Moses was regenerated without he holy spirit or he did have the Holy Soirit, I dont know how about this quesation!
If THE ELECT WAS CHOSEN FROM THE FOUNDATIONS OF THE WORLD, AND NOTHING COULD KEEP THEM FROM SCREWING IT UP AND NOT MAKING IT!!!! THEN WHY DID JESUS DIE? WHY DID WE NEED HIM, IF THE ELECT WAS GONNA MAE IT NO MATTER WHAT THEN WHY ON EARTH DO YOU NEED THE BLOODS OF JESUS YOU WERE ALREADY SET IN STONE AT THE FOUNDATION OF THE EARTH!
Is Fallen Mankind capable of cooperating with God?
Posted : 22 Nov, 2011 03:37 AM
Hi Elisha,
May I ask what verses he took out of context and how so?
Secondly, John the Baptist was filled with the Holy Spirit from birth and didn't even ask for it.
Luke 1:15 "For he will be great in the site of the Lord. He is never to take wine or other fermented drink and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit even from birth."
Even his mom Elizabeth was filled. Luke 1:41 "When Elizabeth heard Mary's greeting, the baby leaped in her woman I and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit."
Lastly, without the blood of Jesus, there is no pardon for sin, even for the elect. They were/are elected to be covered in His precious blood. Do the elect believe just like you and I do? Absolutely with great passion and desire just like you and I do.
To be elect means that God has graciously offered Himself in such a way that you desire Him freely and willingly with all your heart and with all your mind. You are actually capable of realizing His great love for us and willingly run to Him.
That faith comes from God(Eph 2:8-9), but it is OUR faith.
Praise the Lord for His mercy and blessings on your day:)
Is Fallen Mankind capable of cooperating with God?
Posted : 22 Nov, 2011 06:53 AM
Thank you PJ, new guy my point is this, they and I guess maybe you believe that JEsuS diDNT DIE FOR EVERYBODY!! He did die for everyone to have a chance to get salvation! he did not just pick out certain people and say I love them and say I dont love the others. We have a choice I know this becasue I know I got saved, I know it because I was there and I know I could have resisted if I had wanted to but I didnt, and I know that God knows who will and who wont, he knows who will submit and who will reject him but that is a huge difference from making us submit, if thats the case its not submision, submision implys an act the act of submiting which means I have to do something which means God dont force us to love him, I will never buy into that lie!! It just dont hold up.. So those verses may make it seem that way and I admited natural man cant understand the things of God but they can hear the word and faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word!! So a man can hear and thenhave the faith enough to get saved.. So thats my point! Men are born bad yes, they cant do anything good, but they can get saved!! I am so sick of this site I am 2 seconds away from canceling myself from it!! These people are trying to make me believe a lie and I wont swalow the devils lies so easaly as some do!
Is Fallen Mankind capable of cooperating with God?
Posted : 22 Nov, 2011 07:52 AM
Elisha, I am sorry to hear that people have been attacking you. There is no place for that and it is certainly not pleasing to the Lord.
It is with great hesitancy that I respond to these posts because I see pride and human flesh attacking each other which does not bring glory to our Father nor edify the body. We should be gracious to one another as we share His precious Word. Even when we have to reprove someone in sin, it is to be done "gently"(Gal 6:1). I pray the Lord give you patience with all of us sinners and that there would be a spirit of grace as we discuss His Word.
Now, as far as God enabling us to believe in Him, this is how I see it. I do not see it as God "forcing" us to believe at all nor do the Scriptures teach that.
If you were hungry and the only two restaurants sold hamburgers, but the one offered it at half price, which place would you eat at?
You would eat at the half price place. Why? Because you would get the exact same meal and you'd pay less. You wouldn't dare spend the extra money to get the same exact meal. Why? Because the price is irresistible compared to the other place. Could you go to the other place if you wanted to? Absolutely, but you never would because the offer at the one place makes it irresistible. Did you freely and willingly choose the half price place? Yes, you absolutely did, with all of your facilities once you saw the price.
It is the same way when God drew you to Himself. He made Himself irresistible to you and you could not help but love Him and put all your faith in Him. Were you forced into it? Nope, just like you weren't forced into the burger joint. You freely choose to once the offer was made clear to you.
I truly don't see the big deal in it. I mean no one complains "unfair" that God choose the Israelites and left the rest of the world at that time to die in their sins. No one EVER mentions it. He certainly didn't choose them because they were more holy or because they were the largest because they weren't. He choose them because He choose them. That's what the bible teaches so therefore I beloved it even if it goes against my sense of fairness. Who am I to judge God right? We would be like the clay to the potter.
All the great doctrines of the bible seem unfeasible and paradoxible to us as only humans. That is where faith comes in.
Is Fallen Mankind capable of cooperating with God?
Posted : 22 Nov, 2011 09:46 AM
James,
I also like what our sister said here:
If THE ELECT WAS CHOSEN FROM THE FOUNDATIONS OF THE WORLD, AND NOTHING COULD KEEP THEM FROM SCREWING IT UP AND NOT MAKING IT!!!! THEN WHY DID JESUS DIE? WHY DID WE NEED HIM, IF THE ELECT WAS GONNA MAE IT NO MATTER WHAT THEN WHY ON EARTH DO YOU NEED THE BLOODS OF JESUS YOU WERE ALREADY SET IN STONE AT THE FOUNDATION OF THE EARTH!
Who are the elect CHOSEN FROM THE FOUNDATIONS OF THE WORLD? Those who will reach the Kingdom of God. They chose to believe that Jesus is God. They are born of God.
God is all-knowing, omniscient.
So, He knows the end from the beginning. It means He knows from the beginning (foundation of the world) those who will reach the Kingdom of Heave. And these people He calls as the elect.
They are chosen from heathen and dying world and they chose to be saved by the Creator of the universe Jesus.
We all 'fly' to the Kingdom of God. But some of us could be crushed by our sins and never reach the final destination...His Kingdom. We all run the race, but only a few could be winners. Isaiah 53, only the SMALL Remnant is saved but salvation is offered to everyone.
Is Fallen Mankind capable of cooperating with God?
Posted : 22 Nov, 2011 03:50 PM
Is Fallen Mankind capable of cooperating with God?
*** YUP !!!...He asked me do something recently I didnt want to do and I did it even though I didnt want to and He already knew that...just when ya "think" ya got Him all figerd out...He shows ya just how Mysterious He really is...:yay:...xo
