Author	Thread: Do you deserve Eternal Death?!?
DontHitThatMark View Profile History	Do you deserve Eternal Death?!? Posted : 6 Dec, 2012 08:41 AM I was reading something about how most "unbelievers" still acknowledge that stealing/murder/rape/etc is wrong, the twist is that they don't think that the rest of their "sins" or attitudes are really sinful or deserving eternal punishment, and it brought a question to my mind. As Christians, how many believe that we deserve ETERNAL death for even the tiniest, most seemingly insignificant sin that we ever committed? :peace::peace: Post Reply
DontHitThatMark View Profile History	Do you deserve Eternal Death?!? Posted : 7 Dec, 2012 07:30 AM They definitely had lots of problems. The verse from Ezekiel I posted seems very clear to me though. The Israelites were believing that if a father sinned, the children bore the guilt as well, and God is directly saying, "don't say that anymore, the soul that sins will die". I would say that until a child sins, they are innocent. I would even say that until a child discovers the difference between right and wrong, sin is not imputed to them, and they are still considered innocent in God's eyes. 2 Samuel 12:21-23 21 Then said his servants unto him, What thing is this that thou hast done? thou didst fast and weep for the child, while it was alive; but when the child was dead, thou didst rise and eat bread? 22 And he said, While the child was yet alive, I fasted and wept: for I said, Who can tell whether God will be gracious to me, that the child may live? 23 But now he is dead, wherefore should I fast? can I bring him back again? I shall go to him, but he shall not return to me. This verse implies that David will see his son again, and if any child was born with sin, it would definitely be that child. I sure didn't expect this discussion!:laugh: :peace::peace: Post Reply
View Profile History	Do you deserve Eternal Death?!? Posted : 7 Dec, 2012 07:36 AM To clarify, I believe we are born into a sin nature. I do not believe a baby comes out and starts immediately sinning. I also tend to believe babies will be saved. I don't know this for a fact, but I think a decent case can be made from scripture. Obviously we can't pick an age where we say that a child is now responsible and can be sent to hell. We just have to trust that God's judgments are good and that is enough for me. Post Reply
DontHitThatMark View Profile History	Do you deserve Eternal Death?!? Posted : 7 Dec, 2012 10:13 AM Amen. :peace::peace: Post Reply
dljrn04 View Profile History	Do you deserve Eternal Death?!? Posted : 7 Dec, 2012 11:49 AM Psalm 51:5 Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me. We were born in sin. i believe infants of believers go to heaven, and infants of unbelievers go to hell. Due to the covenant God made with Abraham in Genesis. It was an everlasting covenant between God and Abraham and to his seed. Post Reply
DontHitThatMark View Profile History	Do you deserve Eternal Death?!? Posted : 7 Dec, 2012 07:05 PM " For I acknowledge my transgressions: and my sin is ever before me. Against thee, thee only, have I sinned, and done this evil in thy sight: that thou mightest be justified when thou speakest, and be clear when thou judgest. Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me." dljrn04: "We were born in sin. i believe infants of believers go to heaven, and infants of unbelievers go to hell. Due to the covenant God made with Abraham in Genesis. It was an everlasting covenant between God and Abraham and to his seed. " I'm not really following your logic on this one. What makes a believer's baby better than an unbeliever's baby? Are children saved because of their parent's belief? Are children damned because of their parent's sin? I also don't see how the verse you posted supports that a child is born responsible of their parents sin, all it has to mean is that David was born into a sinful enviroment or under "sinful" circumstances. I've read that David was the 9th generation product of the illegitimate son of Judah and Tamar, and as such this applied: "A *illegitimate child*(censorship:goofball:) shall not enter into the congregation of the Lord; even to his tenth generation shall he not enter into the congregation of the Lord." Perhaps the verse you posted is about David lamenting his questionable heritage. He also had a Moabite in his recent lineage, Ruth was his great-grandmother, and the same rule applies in that situation as well. Deuteronomy 23:3-6 "An Ammonite or Moabite shall not enter into the congregation of the Lord; even to their tenth generation shall they not enter into the congregation of the Lord for ever: Because they met you not with bread and with water in the way, when ye came forth out of Egypt; and because they hired against thee Balaam the son of Beor of Pethor of Mesopotamia, to curse thee. Nevertheless the Lord thy God would not hearken unto Balaam; but the Lord thy God turned the curse into a blessing unto thee, because the Lord thy God loved thee. Thou shalt not seek their peace nor their prosperity all thy days for ever." I understand that God shows mercy and offers forgiveness to "thousands of them that love me and keep my commandments", but the Jewish people were famous for being sticklers of the law and being very proud of their ancestor's lineage back to Abraham, and they probably treated David and his family pretty badly because of it. :peace::peace: Post Reply
dljrn04 View Profile History	Do you deserve Eternal Death?!? Posted : 7 Dec, 2012 07:29 PM If you don't understand I ask of you to study Gods word particularly Gods covenant with Abraham. I pray God would open your eyes to himself and his word. Post Reply
DontHitThatMark View Profile History	Do you deserve Eternal Death?!? Posted : 8 Dec, 2012 05:23 PM I would like to know how a parent's belief saves their children, I cannot find that concept in the bible. And if children are born with sin like I thought you were saying earlier, then I'm doubly confused. How can a sinful baby be saved by someone elses belief? I've studied the covenant, and all Abraham's seed are not children of the promise. Just because they were a child of Abraham, it does not mean they are a child of God. I'm not confused about what I believe, I'm confused about what you believe, but you do not need explain it if you don't want to, or maybe you have already and I just don't get it. Romans 9:8 "For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed." :peace::peace: Post Reply
dljrn04 View Profile History	Do you deserve Eternal Death?!? Posted : 8 Dec, 2012 06:02 PM If you understood the covenant, you would understand what i believe. God's grace was given to Abraham and his seed, He will be their God, and the seed will be his people. God saves whom he decrees, no human can change that. Therefore all Abraham's seed are part of the covenant, and every believers child is part of that covenant, it is a everlasting covenant. If that child dies it goes to heaven. God decrees it. :yay: Post Reply
DontHitThatMark View Profile History	Do you deserve Eternal Death?!? Posted : 8 Dec, 2012 09:41 PM The verse I just posted says three times that just because they're Abraham's seed, it doesn't mean they're children of the promise. God promised Abraham a land to live in, for his seed to become a great nation, and for all the nations of the earth to be blessed through his seed, not that every single Israelite would be saved. Esau was his seed. Ishmael was his seed. Do you believe every single person in world that is simply just related to Abraham is going to be saved? Romans 9 27 Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved: :peace::peace: Post Reply
dljrn04 View Profile History	Do you deserve Eternal Death?!? Posted : 9 Dec, 2012 03:01 AM You are right you di not understand, may God grant you understanding as you study his truth. :waving: Post Reply

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