Author	Thread: purpose of salvation
dljrn04 View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 16 Nov, 2012 06:38 AM To say that God the Father has purposed the salvation of all mankind, that God the Son died with the express intention of saving the whole human race, and that God the Holy Spirit is now seeking to win the world to Christ; when, as a matter of common observation, it is apparent that the great majority of our fellow-men are dying in sin, and passing into a hopeless eternity: is to say that God the Father is disappointed, that God the Son is dissatisfied, and that God the Holy Spirit is defeated. A.W. Pink Post Reply
View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 28 Nov, 2012 01:40 PM Romans 10 doesn't address anything I've posted. Neither does Romans 11, Revelation 22. 2 Peter 2:1 on the surface seems to do so. However since I have posted numerous verses which show God chose a specific people and since those verses have gone without being refuted...We can safely know that 2 Peter 2:1 does not mean that Jesus died to save those false prophets. Here is a great study for you to read on it....http://vintage.aomin.org/2PE21.html I assume with 2 Peter 3, you are attempting to refute the doctrine of the perseverance of the saints. However this is another doctrine with numerous scriptures supporting it and you can find many defenses for it all over the internet. I would suggest that you go listen to the arguments without presuppositions. That's how I have gotten when I am today in believing reformed theology. You - "I don't believe you have shown. I feel like I'm being pretty consistent. A universalist believes that all will be saved, right?I believe that only those who believe will be saved," Me - I've already addressed this. You deny that you agree with universalism and that wasn't my point. However, your interpretation of certain verses lead to texts ultimately teaching universalism. I even showed how this was so. You have not refuted that other than to say you aren't a universalist. Again, that is not the point. What you are consistent in is saying that you believe every man has an opportunity to be saved. However in your interpretations of scripture, you've been extremely inconsistent. When I show your inconsistencies or how you were out of context, you simply ignore and move on the the next. However, none of these are actually teaching your point. What's more important in your mind....all men having an opportunity, or knowing what the scriptures truly say? "Well, it never says he will give them ice cream if they do repent either, that's not a great argument. God choose Israel, and not all Israel will be saved." Not all Israel is Israel. Actually it's quite a good argument. Since we are talking about belief and you believe all can believe....me pointing out that the verse doesn't teach this is a very good argument. John 1 doesn't refute anything I've posted. With Isaiah 53:6, again you have to establish who the all is. You continue doing this with every new passage you have found. Why don't you slow down on posting new verses for awhile and address the verses I've given as well as addressing when I have shown you to be out of context on other verses. Please address these instead of ignoring and just giving me more and more verses. Jonah 3 does not refute anything I've posted. Acts 7:51....I've already shown from scripture that all of those whom God calls will be saved. So until you deal with those scriptures, you cannot say that Acts 7:51 refers to the Spirit trying to save men while they reject Him. Since Acts 7:51 doesn't even mention the atonement then I don't know we should try to read it into the text. Once again verses like Titus 2:11 are used just because they say "all". The verses prior might give some indication as to why all is used. 2 But as for you, teach what accords with sound[a] doctrine. 2 Older men are to be sober-minded, dignified, self-controlled, sound in faith, in love, and in steadfastness. 3 Older women likewise are to be reverent in behavior, not slanderers or slaves to much wine. They are to teach what is good, 4 and so train the young women to love their husbands and children, 5 to be self-controlled, pure, working at home, kind, and submissive to their own husbands, that the word of God may not be reviled. 6 Likewise, urge the younger men to be self-controlled. 7 Show yourself in all respects to be a model of good works, and in your teaching show integrity, dignity, 8 and sound speech that cannot be condemned, so that an opponent may be put to shame, having nothing evil to say about us. 9 Bondservants[b] are to be submissive to their own masters in everything; they are to be well-pleasing, not argumentative, 10 not pilfering, but showing all good faith, so that in everything they may adorn the doctrine of God our Savior. 11 For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation for all people, All types of people. Slaves be submissive to your masters in everything. For the grace of God has brought salvation to all kinds of people. You also conveniently left out..14 who gave himself for us to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people for his own possession who are zealous for good works.....The fact that God is purifying Himself a specific people for Good works and that this was his plan. As far as Matthew 23:37, give this a good watch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzzqHXgR75k Post Reply
View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 28 Nov, 2012 01:42 PM I would like to go ahead and apologize because I think some of my comments are going to come off as condescending. I just felt like I had already touched on many of the topics that were brought up again with new verses and was frustrated by it. Please forgive me. Post Reply
DontHitThatMark View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 28 Nov, 2012 06:45 PM Well, I understand where you're coming from, but I would rather let the scripture speak for itself. I've already come to grips with the fact that we just interpret scripture through different lenses. I have absolutely no hope of convincing you into my belief system, this discussion is to me for study purposes and to be available for anyone else that wants to take a look at what they scriptures is saying to them. If I say that it means "everybody", you say it doesn't, while I disagree/respect that, I know very well that trying to convince you with my words is not going to work. God and his word will, and nothing else, you're a good christian:rocknroll:. So I will continue to post scripture, and hopefully, the weight of scripture will impress your mind, one way or the other. This belief permeates every single other belief that we each hold, maybe we should discuss "lighter"(if those exist in the bible) topics. I just hope that you don't think I'm purposefully twisting scripture, and that you can see how I believe what I do through the bible. If it was in a different format, we could have a deeper discussion, but a forum is a little too impersonal and slow to do that. :peace::peace: Post Reply
DontHitThatMark View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 28 Nov, 2012 06:48 PM What did you think of the Jonah post? :peace::peace: Post Reply
View Profile History	purpose of salvation Posted : 28 Nov, 2012 07:23 PM Obviously we disagree and I appreciate you taking the time. I will be bowing out now. In the future I may start some threads addressing common verses used against my beliefs Post Reply

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