You had as much to do with your natural birth, as you did your spiritual birth.
Posted : 6 Sep, 2013 12:24 PM
The �Rev�. Billy Graham once wrote a 170 pages book titled � �How to be born-again�. He might as well have written a book on how to be born. For in many ways the natural birth is very similar to the spiritual birth!
And just as we had no say in the former, neither do we have any say in the latter!
In natural birth, we know that the one who is BORN DOES NOT WILL TO BE BORN--in fact, he has NO SAY IN THE MATTER WHATSOEVER. He does not decide the time, place, or circumstances of his birth. He has no power to determine the family into which he will be born etc. The analogy holds true with regard to the spiritual birth. GOD determines the time, place and circumstances. The sinner can no more resist this than can an infant resist and refuse to be born naturally.
This fact is shown so clearly in John 1:13 where speaking of believers it is said, "Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God." i.e. �The new birth is �not of blood (by natural descent), nor of the will of the flesh (his own volition), nor of the will of man (the preacher�s persuasion), but OF GOD� [John 1:13], and the seed which God uses to produce the new birth is His own Word�! [James 1:18]. [A.W. Pink]
This verse kills the doctrine of those who teach that men are saved when they exercise their "free wills" and accept God's "offer" of salvation.
God Sovereignly saves us in Regeneration and THEN CALLS US OR ILLUMINATES US BY THE GOSPEL. �Who hath SAVED US (regeneration), and CALLED US (by the Gospel) with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace etc�. [2Tim 1:9] As I always say we must beware of putting the proverbial �cart before the horse�! A man does not believe the Gospel and GET SAVED but believes the Gospel BECAUSE HE IS SAVED!
This is the reason the Gospel is referred to in the Scriptures as a mystery! Because only to the regenerate it is the �power of God unto salvation�. The rest can only behold it, wonder about it and perish! �BEHOLD, ye despisers, and WONDER, and PERISH: for I work a work in your days, a work which ye shall in NO WISE BELIEVE, though A MAN DECLARE IT UNTO YOU�. [Act 13:41]
Regeneration is a ONETIME sovereign act of God whereas Conversion is always PARTIAL (on this earth) and CONTINUAL, and can be seen in different parts of our lives at different times. A genuine backslider does not need to be regenerated but he needs to be converted. A backslider no matter how far he has strayed is still God�s son and the Lambs bride! �Turn, O backsliding children, saith the LORD; for I AM MARRIED UNTO YOU�! [Jer 3:14] (I say this with tears in my eyes, for I was the greatest backslider of them all) Prior to Peter�s backsliding, the Lord told him � �Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat: But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and WHEN THOU ART CONVERTED, strengthen thy brethren�! [Lk 22:31,32]
And I may finally add that it is in conversion that we unlearn much of the error which we held on to initially after our regeneration. Errors such as �Free will� Universal Atonement, The Pentecostal errors etc.
The path of the just is as the shining light that shineth more and more unto the perfect day! [Prov 4:18] Hallelujah!
You had as much to do with your natural birth, as you did your spiritual birth.
Posted : 6 Sep, 2013 04:36 PM
Amen IWA.
God says "Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God." i.e. �The new birth is �not of blood (by natural descent), nor of the will of the flesh (his own volition), nor of the will of man (the preacher�s persuasion), but OF GOD� [John 1:13]
pj say's "In your natural birth you have.no choice. spirtaual comes froms decision."
That is a big difference, one is truth, one is false teaching.
You had as much to do with your natural birth, as you did your spiritual birth.
Posted : 6 Sep, 2013 05:52 PM
"This fact is shown so clearly in John 1:13 where speaking of believers it is said, "Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God." i.e. �The new birth is �not of blood (by natural descent), nor of the will of the flesh (his own volition), nor of the will of man (the preacher�s persuasion), but OF GOD� [John 1:13], and the seed which God uses to produce the new birth is His own Word�! [James 1:18]. [A.W. Pink]
This verse kills the doctrine of those who teach that men are saved when they exercise their "free wills" and accept God's "offer" of salvation."
Well, it only "kills" it if you leave it out of context. Those that received Christ, those that believe on his name, are born again by the will of God.
John 1
11He came unto his own, and his own received him not. 12But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: 13Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
"A man does not believe the Gospel and GET SAVED but believes the Gospel BECAUSE HE IS SAVED!"
Sounds like he forgot to read all these. I got tired of looking them all up, so there are more as well. I just did simple words searches, but there are many more direct examples in the bible, especially the parables of Jesus.
Mat 21:32
For John came unto you in the way of righteousness, and ye believed him not: but the publicans and the harlots believed him: and ye, when ye had seen it, repented not afterward, that ye might believe him.
Mar 1:15
And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.
Mar 5:36
As soon as Jesus heard the word that was spoken, he saith unto the ruler of the synagogue, Be not afraid, only believe.
Luk 13:3
I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.
Luk 8:12
Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.
Jhn 1:12
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
Jhn 3:18
He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
Jhn 6:29
Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
Jhn 4:41
And many more believed because of his own word;
Jhn 8:24
I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.
Jhn 11:40
Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
Jhn 12:47
And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Jhn 16:27
For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God.
Jhn 17:20
Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
Jhn 20:29
Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.
Jhn 20:31
But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.
Act 4:4
Howbeit many of them which heard the word believed; and the number of the men was about five thousand.
Act 11:21
And the hand of the Lord was with them: and a great number believed, and turned unto the Lord.
Act 15:7
And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
Act 15:11
But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.
Act 3:19
Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;
Act 26:20
But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.
Acts 8
36And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? 37And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. 38And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.
Act 16:31
And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.
Rom 3:22
Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
Rom 4:11
And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:
Rom 4:20-24
20 He staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God; And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform. And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness. Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him; But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead; Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.
Rom 10:9
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:14
How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
Rom 11:19-23
Thou wilt say then, The branches were broken off, that I might be graffed in. Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee. Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off. And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.
1Cr 1:21
For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
2Cr 4:4
In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
Gal 3:22
But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.
1Th 2:13
For this cause also thank we God without ceasing, because, when ye received the word of God which ye heard of us, ye received it not as the word of men, but as it is in truth, the word of God, which effectually worketh also in you that believe.
1Ti 1:16
Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.
1Ti 4:10
For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.
Hbr 10:39
But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.
Hbr 11:6
But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
1Jo 3:23
And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.
1Jo 5:13
These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.
Rev 2:21
And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.
You had as much to do with your natural birth, as you did your spiritual birth.
Posted : 6 Sep, 2013 06:51 PM
�A man does not believe the Gospel and GET SAVED but believes the Gospel BECAUSE HE IS SAVED!
This is the reason the Gospel is referred to in the Scriptures as a mystery!�
The Gospel is Y-shua and salvation through Him alone before the foundation of the world � was the cross� this is the mystery!!!! Jews reject Him and do the non-Jews�. They can�t get over the stumbling block of Y-shua.
I was not not any other human saved until G-d lifted the vial from my eyes and I confessed I am a sinner against You� SAVE ME, I cried out. I was saved � the end.
You had as much to do with your natural birth, as you did your spiritual birth.
Posted : 6 Sep, 2013 10:41 PM
"He came unto his own, and his own received him not. But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God."
Those who received Christ were different from those who did not receive Him. These verse explain the difference. Those who were born of the flesh did not receive Him but those who were born of God did. It was those whom God Himself birthed by the power of His Spirit who are called the Sons of God. (B'nai ha Elohim). It was those that He empowered to become His sons. This is clearly stated.
Further, it was not by fleshly birth,(of blood), not by the will of man - either his own will (flesh) or another's man's will. It was solely of God.
You had as much to do with your natural birth, as you did your spiritual birth.
Posted : 7 Sep, 2013 11:53 AM
"In your natural birth you have.no choice. spirtaual comes froms decision.."
So, you just arbitrarily change the meaning of birth? Birth is birth..... birth is NOT decision.
Really You surely did not say that, it must be a missprint.
So, you just arbitrarily change the meaning of birth? Birth is birth..... birth is NOT decision.
So you say I changed the meaning of birth, and then you say Birth is not decison.
DID You Really Say That?
I said spiritual birth comes from a decision, I did not say anything close to what you said, My statement is 100 per cent in agreement with scripture, and wholly exposing false teaching.
So You want people to believe, God makes you Hear, God makes You Believe, God makes you Receive?
You had as much to do with your natural birth, as you did your spiritual birth.
Posted : 7 Sep, 2013 12:51 PM
"Further, it was not by fleshly birth,(of blood), not by the will of man - either his own will (flesh) or another's man's will. It was solely of God. "
Yes, I would say that God is making a time distinction between the fleshy birth and being born again by the spirit. We're not born of the spirit when we're born, we're born of the spirit when we receive Christ. We're not saved until we're saved. Pretty simple.
You had as much to do with your natural birth, as you did your spiritual birth.
Posted : 7 Sep, 2013 12:55 PM
dead men can not receive anything Mark, God must breath life into you, before you can receive. It is not that hard, the only hard part is man want's glory and will not give the glory to God alone. It is a shame man is so prideful.
You had as much to do with your natural birth, as you did your spiritual birth.
Posted : 7 Sep, 2013 02:34 PM
Yes, I would say that God is making a time distinction between the fleshy birth and being born again by the spirit. We're not born of the spirit when we're born, we're born of the spirit when we receive Christ. We're not saved until we're saved. Pretty simple.
180 degrees wrong. You are not born again when you "receive Christ." by your will. You are first first born again of the Spirit by the will of God. The evidence of this is that you believe the truth.
