I thank our father for his Word, even his only begotten son, the Christ and most holy Messiah of God; Jesus. For it is Jesus who is our saviour and our redeemer, the one whom we adore and hold fast too in times of temptation and trial, as well as thank in times of blessing and rejoicing. It is he who intercedes for us to our father Abba, the God of Israel, the Alpha and Omega, the author and finisher of our faith, so that we may even be made to be righteous in his holy sight. Not by our own deeds, for we have given of our own selves to follow our Lord Jesus; but by his blood, by faith through his infinite grace.
As we fellowship I pray that he shows us his truth so that we are not in error but that we may understand his plans for us and that we may be a empty vessels for his spirit to fill. Be it unto you my Lord, the Lion of Judah, Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus, in your mighty name and by your beautiful blood I pray, Amen.
I wish to counter a doctrine which is amongst the Church known as 'Once saved always saved'. Let me explain why I believe, through guidance from the Holy Spirit, the Word and various brethren, that it is a dangerous doctrine. Like many such others, because it contains a grain of truth, it sounds plausible but is overall very misleading.
Many Christians believe that once a person is saved, it essentially doesn't matter what sin they commit between the day they are saved and the day they finally die, they will still inherit the kingdom of God. There are a number of scriptures these people use to defend this position, and there are of course scriptures which I could use to counter it. I am however merely going allow the Holy Spirit to speak through me though (there will no doubt be quotes from scripture but I simply won't attempt to reference them at the moment.
Firstly I find it peculiar that any true disciple of Christ would wish to try to reason this way, it just seems that they are trying to find a reason to keep on sinning! When it is explicit throughout all the scripture, in both the Old and New Testaments that sin IS enmity from God.
Secondly I have experience with backsliding, with going into sin after receiving my salvation, and right after I sinned, I not only didn't feel like I was saved (until I repented again and had forgiven myself) but I actually know that God was not in me, I found it incredibly difficult to pray. I would feel very empty. In fact, it makes sense because if we are the temple of God, and God is holy; how could he remain abiding in us if we desecrate his temple?
Thirdly, though Christ did say that anything which the father has given to him he cannot lose, he also said that his sheep follow him, surely we cannot call ourselves his sheep if we do not follow him, and Jesus only says that he cannot lose us, not that we cannot go astray if we choose to. Put it this way, if it were impossible for us to lose our salvation, that would be tantamount to God forcing us to stay with him on the basis of one decision we've made, God doesn't want to force us to come to him, he wants us to choose.
If a person wilfully disobeys his will and sins, fornicates for instance; then they are choosing in that instance to follow satan, to be disobedient to God and to want to put his/her own selfish interests before Gods eternal plan. How can this person remain saved at that moment? If they have chosen disobedience, how can they then not be a child of disobedience.
Of course the person can then repent, and as long as they repent (truthfully) and sincerely hand themselves over to the mercy of God, then Jesus can again wash them clean. But therein lies the problem, if a person is continuously doing this back and forth, sin then repentance routine; how can they be truly repenting every time? Ought they not in some way in the back of their mind be thinking "I can always go back into my sins sometime later and do this all over again"?
This is called being hot and cold and Jesus will spue such a person out.
It is the easiest thing in the world (at least the first time!) to give your life to Christ and become a Christian, but it is (in my opinion) the hardest thing in the world to remain one. Jesus himself said that the path is narrow that leads to everlasting life, whilst the path is broad and wide that leads to eternal damnation, it is clear that we have to fight for our salvation continuously. When Christ died on the cross, he only needed to do it once and then it was finished for good, so from Gods point of view, his work is done, but from our point of view it isn't a one time deal, we have to 'work out our salvation'. There are ways and means to do this, perhaps they are for a different discussion, (simply put, Prayer and fellowship with Jesus through his Word and his Church) but I firmly believe that we can no longer play around with Gods mercy, this is so important, we must remain as holy as we can be, it is no game.
I thank Jesus for his precious blood which brought our freedom and our salvation, I thank him for giving us the power to be sons and daughters of his father the Most High God, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. I pray that he strengthens us in every way he can against conformity to the wickedness of this world, so that we may be able to present ourselves totally blameless on the day of judgement. And though it may not be because of our own works, but by his works, we do not want to make him a liar when he said it is finished, because we know that if we are disobedient, we crucify him all over again. I pray these things by the broken body and the awesome name of Jesus, Amen.
"Once saved always saved" is a doctrine promoted by LAWLESS Christopagans, to justify their LAWLESSNESS, and to lure YHWH's babes over to their father, to devour them.
1 John 2:4
The one saying, "I have known Him," and not keeping His directions, he is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1 John 3:8
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of YHWH does not commit sin; for His seed remains in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of YHWH.
1 John 3:4
Whoever commits sin transgresses also the LAW: for sin is the transgression of the LAW.
Matthew 7:23
But I will reply, 'I never knew you. Get away from me, you who work lawlessness.
"He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God." John 3:18
If you don't believe now, it is a truth that you have never believed in the past.
The new birth is a reality, not an illustration. You con't get born into a family, get kicked out of it, and get born into it again. The new birth is just as real as the physical birth, and it is an irreversible act time time, just like the physical birth.
It's not that you were and now aren't a christian, it is that you never were, and were just exposed as one who never was. "They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us." 1 John 2:19
"For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance." Romans 11:29
As one reads the Bible to their own understanding, many times they are faced with a teaching they never know. It is only when one can set aside perceived ideas, or what I call denominational doctrine can they open their hearts to truth.
To teach that a person can give their life to HaShem (God), except Yeshua (Jesus) as their Savoir, sin, and nothing is wrong is wrong.
Please if you will read Rom 11. I will only post a part of that passage. However I do ask that anyone wishing to post on it read it all. It is with reading of a whole passage, that one can place it into it''s true context. If only one, or a part of a verse is given, that can be twisted.
Also one must note that the foundation of all scripture is the Torah, ( first 5 Books of the Bible) if we do not understand that, we have no hope of knowing the rest.
So as I was doing. Romans 11
19 So you will say, "Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in."
20 True, but so what? They were broken off because of their lack of trust. However, you keep your place only because of your trust. So don't be arrogant; on the contrary, be terrified!
21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, he certainly won't spare you!
This is from the Complete Jewish Bible. This not the only text that makes the point of once saved you can be lost.
Look at Rev. 14:12 This is when perseverance is needed on the part of God's people, those who observe his commands and exercise Yeshua's faithfulness.
Are we past the laws, or prophets? Do we now live in a world that has no bind to the teachings and Laws of HaShem? I think not. Even Yeshua told us in His words.
Mat. 5:17-18
17 "Don't think that I have come to abolish the Torah or the Prophets. I have come not to abolish but to complete.
18 Yes indeed! I tell you that until heaven and earth pass away, not so much as a yud or a stroke will pass from the Torah -- not until everything that must happen has happened.
As one can see, the world is still here, not everything written by the prophets has came to pass. If it had we would live in a new world, not this one.
One must open their hearts and minds to new ways of looking at things. After all when I was I child, Cool meant what Sick does today. One must dop all they can to keep the ideas and slang in it's true age. we must bend our thinking to fit the teaching, not the teaching to fit our ideas.
"You do err knowing neither the scriptures nor the power of God" - Jesus Christ Matthew 22:29
It is not the Torah that is the foundation of scripture, but rather, the Torah is scripture, set upon the foundation of Almighty God, even Jesus Christ, the living Word.
Do Christians sin? Only one way to know. Find out what God says, for He is the final authority in all matters.
"And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ. I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able. For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and division, are ye not carnal, and walk as men? ... According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. For other foundation can no man lay than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the first shall try every man's work, of what sort it is. If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. Know ye no that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are." 1 Corinthians 13
As you can plainly see, Paul identifies these people at Corinth as members of the body of Christ, saying they are "brethren" and that they have the Holy Spirit living in them, and they are the temple of the Holy Spirit.
Yet, though they be Christians, Paul rebukes them severely. In chapter 3 he chides them for still being spiritual babies, still needing the milk of the word, and not able to handle the meat of the word. He He continues in the following chapters to severely rebuke them for a variety of sin. Chapter 5 talks about the open sexual sin in the church, and the sin of failing to deal with the open sin in the church.
So then, how do you reconcile this sin by believers with what John says in 1 John, i.e., "Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for His seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God."? Paul addresses this in depth in Romans chapters 6-8. It is the co-existence of the two natures within the same body of the old man and the new man. Practically speaking, we are to consider the old man dead, a truth of our future which has yet to actually occur, because while we live in the flesh, the old man is still alive, and wars against the Spirit. We "consider" the old man as dead, and ignore the orders he gives, in submission to the Spirit. But even the great Apostle Paul admits to his ongoing battle and sin in that he lets the old man get the victory from time to time, even though he hates that he does that.
The new man, born of the Spirit, does not sin, however, the old man only knows sin. Therefore it is a question to whom we yield our members, at any given moment. It is impossible for the new man to sin, but we deal with the practical reality of having the presence of the old man in the same physical body as the new man. We must be ever vigilant to be in a state of submission to God, (James 4:7), and "walk in the Spirit", otherwise, we, Christians, grieve the Holy Spirit with our sin. (See Ephesians 4)
Scripture never contradicts itself, because God does not lie. It is not enough to know the context of one passage of scripture, but rather, all scripture must be reconciled with all other scripture so it does not seem to contradict itself in our minds. This is why we are commanded in 2 Timothy 2 to "Study to show ourselves approved unto God ... ." It is essential to start with the pure milk of the word (1 Peter 2:1-3), but then we must grow and graduate to the meat of the word as well (1 Corinthians 3). If you don't understand the necessity of spending time in God's word; the need to feed and feast upon it, may I respectfully suggest you sit down and read through Ps 119 in one sitting, and glean the theme of that important chapter.
True the Torah is in a way scripture. Yet if one looks at the first chapter of John, we also find that the Torah Is HaShem. No mater how one looks at it, the Torah is the foundation up on which all scripture must be based. If not, that teaching will not stand the test of truth.
