Trucker: Have you ever laid hands on someone and prayed for healing? Or do you pray "God's will" to be done.
Of course this short interview with Bill doesnt fully express their "what we believe" and so I knew it would get picked apart BUT I know him personally and have spent time with their congregants, they are so in LOVE with the Father and they pray for people with such faith, I admire their faith.
There is something going on there and it's God.
Yes, Bill mentions Kathryn Kuhlman and it doesnt mean he agrees with everything she said or did but he said the Lord really liked to hang out with her...meaning healings took place at her conferences.
Just want you to know that you replied JUST how I thought you would.
River,Yeshua when He had healed certain peole,He had them inspected by the local priests according to the Word of YHWH.
Luk 17:11 And it came to pass, as he went to Jerusalem, that he passed through the midst of Samaria and Galilee.
Luk 17:12 And as he entered into a certain village, there met him ten men that were lepers, which stood afar off:
Luk 17:13 And they lifted up their voices, and said, Jesus, Master, have mercy on us.
Luk 17:14 And when he saw them, he said unto them, Go shew yourselves unto the priests. And it came to pass, that, as they went, they were cleansed.
Luk 17:15 And one of them, when he saw that he was healed, turned back, and with a loud voice glorified God,
Luk 17:16 And fell down on his face at his feet, giving him thanks: and he was a Samaritan.
Luk 17:17 And Jesus answering said, Were there not ten cleansed? but where are the nine?
Lev 13:1 And the LORD spake unto Moses and Aaron, saying,
Lev 13:2 When a man shall have in the skin of his flesh a rising, a scab, or bright spot, and it be in the skin of his flesh like the plague of leprosy; then he shall be brought unto Aaron the priest, or unto one of his sons the priests:
Lev 13:3 And the priest shall look on the plague in the skin of the flesh: and when the hair in the plague is turned white, and the plague in sight be deeper than the skin of his flesh, it is a plague of leprosy: and the priest shall look on him, and pronounce him unclean.
Lev 13:4 If the bright spot be white in the skin of his flesh, and in sight be not deeper than the skin, and the hair thereof be not turned white; then the priest shall shut up him that hath the plague seven days:
Lev 13:5 And the priest shall look on him the seventh day: and, behold, if the plague in his sight be at a stay, and the plague spread not in the skin; then the priest shall shut him up seven days more:
Lev 13:6 And the priest shall look on him again the seventh day: and, behold, if the plague be somewhat dark, and the plague spread not in the skin, the priest shall pronounce him clean: it is but a scab: and he shall wash his clothes, and be clean.
Lev 13:7 But if the scab spread much abroad in the skin, after that he hath been seen of the priest for his cleansing, he shall be seen of the priest again:
Here we have the Word of YHWH,and the witness of the Priests.
Where then are the witnessed to these healings.
Could modern day doctors with x-ray,cat scans,mri and other machines be witnesses to healings.
Or do we just take the persons word.
I would rather believe YHWH and take His way,then that of mans.
There are way tooo many charlitans taking advantage of the Biblical ignorance of the sheeple in this country.
As you said,i did answer as i would.
I answered Biblicaly,intelligently using the Word of YHWH, my Spirit and mind to discern the situation..
I will by the Grace of GOD continue discerning and answering the same fashion.
The LORD,never has said that I shoud leave my mind out when discerning anything.
why would someone say God healed someone if it wasnt true? I dont understand that...your thinking someone would brag on God healing cancer to bring attention to themselves?
Healings do glorify God...right? Just checkin...
Do you believe that God does miracles today? Or did God stop being God when the apostles died?
The major doctrines of the Faith movement were plagiarized by Kenneth Hagin from the teachings of E.W. Kenyon. Kenyon (1867-1948), who gained much of his theology from the mind-science cults, predominantly metaphysics. He incorporated these teachings with his Christian beliefs in an attempt to satisfy the desires for, as he termed it, a new type of Christianity which people had been longing for. Hagin adopted many of these ideas, adding his own theological views gained from his days in classical Pentecostalism and healing revivalism. The five central doctrines of the Faith movement: Revelation Knowledge, Identification, Faith, Healing and Prosperity, however, were all taken from Kenyon's writings, a man who often drank from the well of the Metaphysical cults, particularly, New Thought and Christian Science (http://www.africanaquatics.co.za/_christian/_articles/word_of_faith.htm).
Word of Faith Theology Features a blend of mysticism, dualism, flavors of Gnosticism, and other teachings from the metaphysical cults.
Some of the false doctrines of the Word of Faith movement
� CONTINUING REVELATION-THEREFORE NO NEED FOR QUALITY EXEGESIS OF THE SCRIPTURES.
� JESUS NEEDED TO BE BORN AGAIN
� JESUS WENT TO HELL
� MEN ARE GODS
Someone wrote a comment on amazon.com about the Word of Faith movement which I have included below.
The Word of Faith movement is deceiving countless people, causing them to grasp after a way of life and faith that is not biblical. Our hope is in the Lord, not in our own words, not even in our own faith (Psalm 33:20-22). Our faith comes from God in the first place (2 Peter 1:1), and is not something we create for ourselves. Everything around that teaching involves prosperity and what God wants to do for you. Truth is that is partly true. It's not exactly a lie; it's just OUT OF BALANCE. God does want to heal and restore us. But that's not the only thing He wants to do. And when we start majoring in the minors, we get off balance.
Following are examples of the Prophets and Apostles Problems:
1. Paul had a chronic illness with his Eyes
2. Timothy had stomach problems
3. Jonah was depressed to the point of death
4. Peter was crushed in His Spirit after rejecting Christ three times
5. Billy Graham who has personality preached to over 200 million people, yet he has a disease that is killing him. And he was sadden because his wife died is this because of a lack of faith or from God punishment to un-confessed sins?
6. Stephen was stoned
7. James the Great was beheaded
8. Peter was Crucified upside down, Jesus even told him he would die this way John 21
9. Jesus only owned the Clothes on his back, he never married, he was hated, tracked down, betrayed by a close friend, falsely accused, wiped, tortured, and Murdered. And He said others would do the same to us (Mat 10:22, Mat 24:9) was this because Jesus sinned or had a lack of Faith? Why would He warn us if it were not true?
10. 200K believers die every year just because they are Christians from all over the world, is this due their sin?
We ask, knowing we have not yet been given a "yes" from Him for here and now. Yes, we know and confirm it is His will for us to be healed, but that may not be until heaven. We pray for our request (please heal Father) and ask "if in your will." We can't forget that. I've read and know you believe that. But that's not what's being taught if you follow the above statements. By stating otherwise "I am healed Father from this sickness".... that is going against how He asked us to pray. We pray and have faith He can do it, even now. But when we are not healed, we trust in Him and whatever purpose for that is. Like Jesus prayed when facing the cross... "Nevertheless, not my will but thine be done." He is our example on how to pray..
GOD DOES HEAL. I've been lead to see that He doesn't heal everyone the same way. (Consider the miracle in Acts 9:32-43) We know that God wants to ease our suffering. And in our healings, He's also giving us a taste of the future... our future restoration. With our healings, we see that God wants to reveal himself to us. I also understand that God wants me to pray for healing... And when I'm healed, God uses that healing to build my faith. Scripture is clear that God is more concerned with my faith, heart and devotion, than my physical healing. That is what effects eternity and secures my future. It's my faith that God wants to build. And most of the time, all I see narrowly is how He is or is not coming through for me. Disappointment and bitterness can then sink in. But God wants to do more than heal me physically.
Obviously not all Word of Faith teachers hold to all the same doctrines and the list above is exhaustive. Below are some names of some of the Word of faith teachers.
Hey Homer (I have been calling people Homer for a long time,long before the Simpsons).
Most of, if not all of those you listed are Charlitans,fakes,liars and fleecing the sheeple,because of Biblical ignorance and for not USING THEIR MINDS to be discerning the truth
. When will the people see that they are fodder for these clowns. 2Tim 4:1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;
2Tmi 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
2Tmi 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
2Tim 4:4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
2Tmi 4:5 But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.
Here is what Yeshua says about these people.
2Pe 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
2Pe 2:2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.
2Pe2:3 And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not.
2Pe 2:9 The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished:
2Pe 2:10 But chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness, and despise government. Presumptuous are they, selfwilled, they are not afraid to speak evil of dignities.
2Pe 2:11 Whereas angels, which are greater in power and might, bring not railing accusation against them before the Lord.
2Pe 2:12 But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;
2Pe 2:13 And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you;
2Pe 2:14 Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:
2Pe 2:15 Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;
2Pe 2:16 But was rebuked for his iniquity: the dumb a*s
speaking with man's voice forbad the madness of the prophet.
2Pe 2:17 These are wells without water, clouds that are carried with a tempest; to whom the mist of darkness is reserved for ever.
2Pe 2:18 For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.
2Pe 2:19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.
2Pe 2:20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
2Pe 2:21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
2Pe 2:22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.
To the shame of the Body of Yeshua,some of these are currently under investigation by the U.S.Government for tax evasion.
This has been posted thoughout the Internet,Television,and Media yet the health and wealthers do not want these thing being made public...
They just say 'Do not touch the Lords annointed'
Is not every Believer in Yeshua ANNOINTED with the same Holy Spirit,Or Are these guys and gals annointed with some OTHER spirit..
Lets quit playing games,and stop being so feeling based and so milk toast based. Lets be faith and truth based believers.
NC- I pretty much can see where your headed and for the most part, it didnt offend me. I know I'm different than you all and I dont expect you to agree. I just think it's so funny when we try to be so "holier than thou" on this forum but sometimes our posts expose who we really are. Others who read it can see the true colors of that person. Thus, the enemy is exposed through unbelief.
I wanted to add that I have prayed for many peole who did not get healed ON THE SPOT. I have also prayed for people who had pain and the pain DID leave on the spot. I've prayed for a woman who had migraine headaches for years and hasnt had one since I prayed for her (3 months ago) and I have a long list of similar things.
Now, the effects of the prayer has nothing to do with me. It has everything to do with God. I know that. God chose to heal these people. It has alot to do with our faith and testimony. It increased my faith for sure...to pray for more people! For the person who gets touched by God, can you imagine the love they feel from the Father? There are also those who get prayed for over and over again and nothing. Does that mean God doesnt love them, of course it doesnt.
it just isnt the time and I dont know if it ever will be their time, only God knows.
Not having migraines for 3 months does not constitute a miracle.
Having an arm or leg grow back is a miracle.
Miracles are events/things/situations,circumstances,which only YHWHW is able to do.
I have a friend in Toms River,N.J. who can atest to those that are charlitans.I will call my friend Homer
Homer went to a meeting where a guy says the Lord wants to heal people,so Homer goes up front.
People are falling down,and or supposedly being healed of the LORD.
The guy supposedly healing comes to Homer,and the guy says the Holy Spirit has spoken to me and he wants to heal your foot.
The guy prays for Homers L/foot.
Homer says to this guy,just loud enough for those around to hear.
I have scars up and down my body.
He says,I have had 3 hip replacements
Some of my intestines removed.
I have bad asthma.
High blood pressure.
Bad knees
Health Problems from many years of taking Prednizone for asthma.
I have a bad back,
Bad eyesight
I walk with a cane(at the time Homer was about 45;he is now 53).
Hair lose
Homer says to this guy,of all the problems i have; could not the Holy Spirit have had you pray for something other than my left foot in which there is absolutely nothing wrong.
I do believe YHWH does heal,and that there are miracles,but only to the Glory of Yeshua through the proclaimation of the REAL GOSPEL of YESHUA.(Caps for emphasis only)no yelling lets play nicely.
When will we stop chasing Yeshua for what He could do for us.
When we could be following after Yeshua for who He is,and knowing Him for who He is and what He is like.
when we follow Yeshua for who He is,do we also not have everything that He is ahd has.
If you RE-read my post I didnt say that it was a miracle that she hadnt had a migraine in 3 month...I simply said I prayed for her and she hasnt had one since.
Your speaking of a leg growing back. Well I've seen a woman who needed to wear special inserts in her shoes (2") because one leg was shorter than the other. The guy in the video, Chad, he prayed for her leg to grow out and it did..and YES I was there and it was videotaped.
she no longer has to wear those inserts...i would say that's a miracle. That was lets say, almost 4 years ago. Wow, God sure is good, isnt he?
this will be my last post on this...until next time.
River, I still love ya, even if we don.t see eye to eye, we all are still all brothers and sisters in the Lord. The main thing is don't turn Christianity into a religion, that's not love. A pastor told me once the only thing we have to do as a Christian should be to love Jesus with all your heart and soul and to love one another. Lot's of meaning in such a little statement.
We are living in the last generation and Jesus spoke about many things that will happen in the last days in Matthew 24.
All those things are happening today so just watch for them and be on alert at all times. Jesus talked about many will come to deceive us with false doctrines and false prophets. The feel good churches are everywhere today. The gospel is falling away. The gate is narrow so beware.
As for prayer for healing, my prayers and my church just witnessed a healing in my best friend 3 weeks before he died.
We had been praying for weeks for a miracle with my friend's deadly cancer, but we were also praying that he would come to repentance to our Savoir and be saved. We know God can and will answer prayers, not on our terms but his and his only. Our timing is not God's timing. He makes it happen and we should always give him the praise and glory. My friend did accept the Lord as his Savior before he died and I praise God and give him the glory. I was with him when the Lord intervene. The way it happen was not from man. The way it happen was devine inspiration from 7 choices that 5 people had to make being at the same resturant that day.
Might I ask,Why is it that when health and wealthers are confronted with the Word of GOD and with intelligent understandings of The LORD,they almost always run away..
Why do health and wealthers only want peopleto believe what they believe,they really do not want to hear what others have to say about matters of Yeshua.
Why are H&W's only concerned about healing and wealth,they almost never want to talk about the Character of GOD.
Rarely do they ever talk about being persecuted for their faith,or sacrificing their lives or their earthly things for the benefit of others.
They always say we have the victory in Christ,yet they never will admit the defeats.
They seem to have a twisted understanding of Yeshua,and the Word of GOD,all they can see is health and wealth upon the pages of Scripture.
They talk about prosperity for everyone,yet they do not understand their own spiritual poverty.
Mat 5:3 Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
I have had migraines,I have one now,for almost the past 36 hours.
There has been time,weeks even months without one,and then out of nowhere,i get incapacitated by one.
I have people praying for the LORD to heal me of these,yet ABBA uses them for His glory,How at this moment i do not know,yet one day I will know even as I am known.
YHWH does what He wants,when He wants and how He wants to.
I have to have Him line up my will with His and pray accordingly.
River;
I Love you,yet you have posted more about health and wealthers then about the Character,attitude and personality of YHWH, or Yeshua.
You seem to talk more about the Holy Spirit than about Yeshua.
The Holy Spirit does not promote Himself,nor does He bring attention to Himself.
His focus is to Glorify Yeshua.
John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.
John 16:8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
John 16:9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;
John 16:10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more;
John 16:11 Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged.
John 16:12 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now.
John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
John 16:14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
John 16:15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
