The first time I read this verse I had to find out what it was about.
Isa 58:9 Then shalt thou call, and the LORD shall answer; thou shalt cry, and he shall say, Here I am. If thou take away from the midst of thee the yoke, the putting forth of the finger, and speaking vanity; (KJV)
I was particularly curious about " the putting forth of the finger". I have heard some people teach that this has something to do with pointing the finger in an accusatory way. I found this to be untrue and here is what I found in some commentaries about this.
Matthew Henry: seems to have been then, as sometimes with us, a sign of displeasure and the indication of a purpose to correct. Let not the finger be put forth to point at those that are poor and in misery, and so to expose them to contempt; such expressions of contumely as are provoking, and the products of ill-nature, ought to be banished from all societies.
John Gill: pointing at those that could not comply with them, by way of scorn and derision, as puritans, schismatics, &c. and persecuting them for it; and so is the same with smiting with the fist of wickedness, Isa_58:4
Jamieson, Fausset and Brown: the finger of scorn pointed at simple-minded godly men. The middle finger was so used by the Romans.
Can it be that the God has actually told us not to flip people off? If you think about it it makes sense in the context of this verse. Check it out and tell me what you think.
Well, I don't know that it is possible to know with certainty what is being referred to by "the finger" in that verse. My Bible lists Proverbs 6:13 as a cross-reference to that. Here's the passage:
12 A scoundrel and villain,
who goes about with a corrupt mouth,
13 who winks with his eye,
signals with his feet
and motions with his fingers,
14 who plots evil with deceit in his heart�
he always stirs up dissension.
15 Therefore disaster will overtake him in an instant;
he will suddenly be destroyed�without remedy.
It's plural in that passage, of course, but would seem to indicate some kind of hand gesture or a group of hand gestures that is were considered offensive or inappropriate. Flipping people off could be one of those things. It's hard to say...
Totally unhelpful post here, eh? Doesn't really answer your question! =)
Well for what it is worth, I was taught that the putting forth the finger refers to a threat to put violence to action.
I was led to believe that this putting forth the finger was an ancient middle east gesture, taken over by some jewish tribes, to show that the talking was over but not the fight. It was not only a threat but a clear signal that there was something on the way....
So put in this bible verse it would read:
Then shalt thou call, and the LORD shall answer; thou shalt cry and he shall say, Here I am. If thou take away from the midst of thee the yoke, the threat to put violence to action, and speaking vanity
The chapter deals about fastening and keeping the shabbat. The way it is done is quite meaningless to the LORD. Through the prophet the LORD explains with what attitude it should be done.
This specific verse
if Israel takes away from their midst the yoke etc etc ,....,..... then (verse 10) their light will shine in darkness and their darkness will be like the noon.
"Then you shall call, and the Lord will answer, you shall cry for help, and he will say: Here I am! If you remove from your midst oppression, false accusation and malicious speech;"
Yes, I agree with you Thunder.... We gotta take care about pointing the fingers at others less we forget who we are, and where we come from.
Matthew Henry�s Concise Commentary expands a little pre and post to your scripture reference. In particular it says, which I think is related to �pointing of the finger�:
Henry writes � But they indulged pride, covetousness, and malignant passions. To be liberal and merciful is more acceptable to God than mere fasting, which, without them, is vain and hypocritical. Many who seem humble in God�s house, are harsh at home, and harass their families. But no man�s faith justifies, which does not work by love.�
If we aren't real careful, we could be pegged "vain and hypocrital". ~ GraceMae
v9then you shall call, and the Lord will answer; you shall cry, and he will say, Here I am. If you take away from your midst yokes of oppression (wherever you find them), the finger pointed in scorn(toward the oppressed or the godly), and every form of false, harsh, unjust, and wicked speaking, v10 and if you pour out that with which you sustain your own life for the hungry and satisfy the need of the afflicted, then shall your light rise in darkness, and your obscurity and gloom become like the noonday.
I dont think it has anything to do with giving "the bird" ;)
I read somewhere in a commentary that is in my library (Which is packed now for my move this weekend) that the Hebrew is different for "pointing" and "putting forth" . Some translations say "show " or show forth" the finger. In that commentary it made it sound as if one was to point in a direction or at something and the showing was to actually exhibit or make a signal with the middle finger.
I was really trying to make for an interesting conversation here since it is so hard to find a forum worth getting involved in any more.
