Exo 30:14 Every one that passeth among them that are numbered, from twenty years old and above, shall give an offering unto the LORD.
Exo 38:26 A bekah for every man, that is, half a shekel, after the shekel of the sanctuary, for every one that went to be numbered, from twenty years old and upward, for six hundred thousand and three thousand and five hundred and fifty men.
Lev 27:3 And thy estimation shall be of the male from twenty years old even unto sixty years old, even thy estimation shall be fifty shekels of silver, after the shekel of the sanctuary.
Num 1:3 From twenty years old and upward, all that are able to go forth to war in Israel: thou and Aaron shall number them by their armies.
Num 1:18 And they assembled all the congregation together on the first day of the second month, and they declared their pedigrees after their families, by the house of their fathers, according to the number of the names, from twenty years old and upward, by their polls.
Num 1:20 And the children of Reuben, Israel's eldest son, by their generations, after their families, by the house of their fathers, according to the number of the names, by their polls, every male from twenty years old and upward, all that were able to go forth to war;
Num 1:22 Of the children of Simeon, by their generations, after their families, by the house of their fathers, those that were numbered of them, according to the number of the names, by their polls, every male from twenty years old and upward, all that were able to go forth to war;
Num 1:24 Of the children of Gad, by their generations, after their families, by the house of their fathers, according to the number of the names, from twenty years old and upward, all that were able to go forth to war;
Num 1:26 Of the children of Judah, by their generations, after their families, by the house of their fathers, according to the number of the names, from twenty years old and upward, all that were able to go forth to war;
Num 1:28 Of the children of Issachar, by their generations, after their families, by the house of their fathers, according to the number of the names, from twenty years old and upward, all that were able to go forth to war;
Num 1:30 Of the children of Zebulun, by their generations, after their families, by the house of their fathers, according to the number of the names, from twenty years old and upward, all that were able to go forth to war;
Num 1:32 Of the children of Joseph, namely, of the children of Ephraim, by their generations, after their families, by the house of their fathers, according to the number of the names, from twenty years old and upward, all that were able to go forth to war;
Num 1:34 Of the children of Manasseh, by their generations, after their families, by the house of their fathers, according to the number of the names, from twenty years old and upward, all that were able to go forth to war;
Num 1:36 Of the children of Benjamin, by their generations, after their families, by the house of their fathers, according to the number of the names, from twenty years old and upward, all that were able to go forth to war;
Num 1:38 Of the children of Dan, by their generations, after their families, by the house of their fathers, according to the number of the names, from twenty years old and upward, all that were able to go forth to war;
Num 1:40 Of the children of Asher, by their generations, after their families, by the house of their fathers, according to the number of the names, from twenty years old and upward, all that were able to go forth to war;
Num 1:42 Of the children of Naphtali, throughout their generations, after their families, by the house of their fathers, according to the number of the names, from twenty years old and upward, all that were able to go forth to war;
Num 1:45 So were all those that were numbered of the children of Israel, by the house of their fathers, from twenty years old and upward, all that were able to go forth to war in Israel;
Num 14:29 Your carcases shall fall in this wilderness; and all that were numbered of you, according to your whole number, from twenty years old and upward, which have murmured against me,
Num 26:2 Take the sum of all the congregation of the children of Israel, from twenty years old and upward, throughout their fathers' house, all that are able to go to war in Israel.
Num 26:4 Take the sum of the people, from twenty years old and upward; as the LORD commanded Moses and the children of Israel, which went forth out of the land of Egypt.
Num 26:62 And those that were numbered of them were twenty and three thousand, all males from a month old and upward: for they were not numbered among the children of Israel, because there was no inheritance given them among the children of Israel.
Num 32:11 Surely none of the men that came up out of Egypt, from twenty years old and upward, shall see the land which I sware unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob; because they have not wholly followed me:
1Ch 23:24 These were the sons of Levi after the house of their fathers; even the chief of the fathers, as they were counted by number of names by their polls, that did the work for the service of the house of the LORD, from the age of twenty years and upward.
1Ch 23:27 For by the last words of David the Levites were numbered from twenty years old and above:
1Ch 27:23 But David took not the number of them from twenty years old and under: because the LORD had said he would increase Israel like to the stars of the heavens.
2Ch 25:5 Moreover Amaziah gathered Judah together, and made them captains over thousands, and captains over hundreds, according to the houses of their fathers, throughout all Judah and Benjamin: and he numbered them from twenty years old and above, and found them three hundred thousand choice men, able to go forth to war, that could handle spear and shield.
2Ch 31:17 Both to the genealogy of the priests by the house of their fathers, and the Levites from twenty years old and upward, in their charges by their courses;
Also, there are many points in the Bible where people did not reign until they were at least twenty. I'll leave that open for anyone who wants to search the scripture for it.
I do not find it a coincidence that our nation and many other began with such a number in order to vote or own land.
I can understand your concern. Personally, the only reason I have the limit on age as far as going up goes, is because my father would feel uncomfortable about it and I don't want him upset by too much age difference. Thirteen is far enough I suppose to stay within my generation.
As far as youth goes, regardless of the law of the land, the Bible says that you are not an adult until you are twenty. The laws of the land may change to allow ten-year olds and I ask anyone, are you going to chase these children and conform to man's law or the Bible's?
Without a picture of you or you telling it, directly or indirectly, have you ever had anyone assume or guess your age? I think this was fun. A bunch of people thought I was thirty and above for some reason, lol.
Well, I don't call it a church. It's a fellowship. I think the churches have gone the way of the synagouges. Things like that tend to repeat and I think lots of people see it.
--How can the bible deemed wrong or right.--
Please, do not twist like that. We are not voting on whether or not we like certain parts. We vote on the theological interpretations of the Bible. The Bible will defend itself in the debates and destroy false doctrine. We do not vote on whether the Bible is wrong or not.
--Exodus 20:3 Is the 3rd Commandment. Thou shall have no other God before me.--
Exactly. A church creed is an example of that.
--In Mark9:35 The bible says " Sitting down, Jesus called the Twelve and said, " If anyone wants to be first, he must be the very last, and the servant of all." In this passage Jesus has over heard the Twelve arguing amoung themselves as to who would be the greatest. So Jesus simply tells all of them that to be first they must put aside their wants and serve others whereby putting themselves last.--
Agreed.
--To serve in the kingdom of God you must serve others.--
I'm sorry, but I am not a believer that works get you into Heaven.
--In other words be a slave, a bond servant, which in the old testament is a slave who has been set free and gives himself back into his masters care as a servant for life, in order to serve God. Because what you do for others in Jesus's name you do for the Father.--
This is being a good servant, but I don't think that God should come last in my life.
--It sounds to me that the scripture has been taken out of context. When a scripture is used it must always be used in the example it was taken from.--
I understand that, but I do not think that it was taken out of context. I think one of His meanings is talking of people who wish to control others or have more merit than them. Mark 9:35 was used to decide on the republic of the United States.
--Phoenyx, You are very young and very wise. The bible is God's word. Which is Holy. It is the very breath of God that has been breathed into the men who wrote each book. Therefore to decide what is good or bad is something that you, yourself should take to God in prayer.--
Each person may do that. There is nothing arguing against guidance from the Lord, but encourages such and Bible reading.
--I can't image God telling anyone that they as a single person or as a group that it's OK to decide only what you want.--
Oh, no, He doesn't say such, but I still see people doing so with all these churches divided. The purpose of the unity in the vote is so that, should there be even one with purer knowledge, they will stop it from going through or fix it after it has. It is demonstrated in the Bible how He would not destroy a place that had His people.
--A good rule to consider is this; If you think that you have read something in the Bible that contradicts itself please reread it , study it in more depth and ask God what He is trying to tell you, because the Bible, God's Word, does not contradict itself.--
Agreed, though I'm not sure how I gave off a different vibe, lol.
--The devil can be very deceptive. Guard your relationship with God with all you have. God loves man remember He made man in His image. If God did not truely love mankind He would not have sent His Only Son, Jesus Christ to die for our sins. God wants all mankind to have enternal life. This is not a debate. Please be on guard, do not let anyone decieve you. I can't stress this enought. I will pray for all of you who attend this group. That God will give you wisdom and discernment in all that you do.--
^_^ Thank you.
--One more thing Jesus said in Matthew 18 :6 "But if anyone causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him to have a millstone hung around his neck and to be drowned in the depts of the sea." The reason I am saying this is because if you have a true believer in your mist and he is mislead, whoever mislead him will be held accountable for his lost salvation, if he loses it because of something mistaught.--
That's the very reason we want this fellowship. Preachers have gone their own way. Church members rarely search the scriptures. Children are subjected only to what their fathers' believe rather than the Bible. The division between churches is ridiculous as well as many things done in the churches. It's like they are having market in their churches when Jesus already toppled tables over it and fulfilled any need for sacrifice.
--Please rethink this group and ask for God's guidence. Pamela If you wish I will give you my private email.--
No, it's fine. I don't mind chatting on here and, believe me, I have been praying about this, as well as many other people. :)
We do think that God and those He used to directly appoint did right, but when the Bible was finished we do not think that mob rule or leaders who are not also servants to those they lead should have appointed because they are neither God nor those saved He used by name in the Bible. Just as in the Bible where it states who were the saved and unsaved where, we were told not to judge the souls of those not specificially judged by God in the Bible. We still think God appoints since all things happen through Him, but hold to servants being leaders and leaders being servants, first as last and last as first. The unity vote is intended to keep the narrow road involved instead of the wide. We hope that this established fellowship will help to teach the Word in a purer fashion than the division found by separate churches.
Don't worry. I have no problem with the asking. I think the only comment on here I was upset about was this one arrogant question that in one go said that I was following a person instead of the Bible and also saying that the author of the comment did not even read the discussion before criticizing; pretty much it was too beneath him. I'm a new Christian too--one year at most--so it's only by God and older Christians that this fellowship was birthed. Thanks for reading btw. Many blessings!
The reason for the debates and voting is that man's interpretation is all too often accepted because of a majority vote or, rather in most places, opinions. A clergical church that preaches one way is no different. Now as far as spreading beliefs, children are certainly not given both.
Also a simple vote does not tell us what is true or not. The unanimous vote is only a result of what the Bible and God tells each and every one of us to be true or not. The vote is not what decides truth.
Looking at our history, you'll see how difficult it is to pass anything with unity, which the Bible encourages; let alone something unanimous about the Bible. It's also up for change should the Lord want it so. The concept of a republic was taken from the Bible and old law books give credit to it.
Deuteronomy 1:6-13: The LORD our God spoke to us at Horeb, saying... Choose wise and discerning and experienced men from your tribes, and I will appoint them as your heads.
Act 6:5
Even God displayed approval voting in Genesis with creation and He has encouraged our discernment, not that we follow after a man, majority or society.
Job 34:1-4: Then Elihu continued and said... Let us choose for ourselves what is right; Let us know among ourselves what is good.
2 Corinthians 5:10: For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
As a sidenote, which I found funny, even bees--the holders of honey--do "elections" for hive-relocation.
As far as the voting in Jesus's trial, we all understand that humans twist Biblical concepts. It is either with or without God's blessing that makes it good or bad. Just as God created hands to work for good and yet humans did evil, that does not mean all hands are evil. Jesus's hands certainly are good and He wants us to strive to do good with our hands as well.
Thanks for the comment, Cattle. I was waiting for the subject to come up.
Thank you to all. For some of the points listed, here are explanations, though I�d have to check with everyone else there to make sure this is presented correctly:
Daylight Services: While we don't abstain from anyone doing anything after sunset, we wish to uphold certain traditions that have Biblical meaning, which, again, may be voted out. In the meantime, we like to note that all lawful activities among the Jews were to be done in daylight. This is because the Lord is light and evil hides in the dark. Luke 22:63-66 They would not even follow their own law when taking Jesus away and having an interrogation in the night.
Peace and Order: We do have parliamentary rules and those elected to enforce them, such as a chairman. Should a person, even an elected, fail to abide, they are removed, though are welcomed back. There are rules on a limit to that, if they only offer consistent interruption. In this way, as many as a thousand may be apart of our fellowship and continue, while removing those that would seek to bring our fellowship into chaos. Another part that is made to prevent anger between fellows is the suggestion that all arguments be written rather than oral. Not only would it allow full responses and allow time for other things, but help to avoid rude tones and comments since it will be permanently seen as copies are made for all members and to be filed.
Why or why not? Comment or criticism (lol, I know that's coming)? Suggestions?
[Pamphlet]
ROSEWOOD FELLOWSHIP
A CHRISTIAN GATHERING FOR WORSHIP AND STUDY
WELCOME!
We thank you for taking the time to read this pamphlet and invite you to join us on a Sunday.
ABOUT US
The Fellowship was organized based on the desire and intent for a better communion and knowledge of our Lord, YHVH, so our schedule is woven around that purpose.
1. Our morning Sunday service seeks to be singing and Bible reading only.
2. Between our Sunday services, we hope to dine together as a family.
3. In hopes that He might send even one person with purer understanding, our evening Sunday service works as a unanimous parliament and founded on Christ�s love, Achdut and Ahava.
ROMANS 10:17
So then faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the word of God.
Adult Americans spend on average more than three hours watching television, but never hear a Bible verse until Sunday, if then. Even fewer have read through the Bible more than once. If only a single message could be spread above all else, we wish this to be that one: Seek His Word.
�KOINONIA�
�Koinonia� is the Anglicization of a Greek word (κοινωνία) that means �communion by intimate participation�. It is used in the Bible to describe the relationship within Christian gatherings. Not only do we apply this through our services, but for Sunday dinners as well and hope to incorporate it into future activities and goals.
WHY WE ARE A FELLOWSHIP
We have no creed. In order to insure open discussion, we make no conclusion that cannot be questioned or changed, lest it be by the Creator�s will. All conclusions are the result of a unanimous vote. This clause and all after may change since, as stated, the congregation may vote differently. Exodus 20:3
We have no membership. By Christ�s love may you come and go as you please. We do not remove unless the person is a disturbance to the proceedings, so all viewpoints and interpretations may be discussed. Exodus 35:5
We have no clergy. While we do have those elected by the congregation to keep the peace, we do not have ordained superiors. We believe that only those appointed by Him in the Bible, and His Biblical servants He used for such, may appoint. By definition, fellow: somebody of the same rank or quality. Therefore, by a consensus vote, we do establish those for order. Mark 9:35
QUESTIONS ASKED
What if someone won�t change their standpoint?
Then they won�t change their standpoint and the debates continue. It�ll allow further Bible study and, if with blessing, greater depth. Written arguments are preferred, so many debates may go on at once, and arguments taken home to read and reply to.
Without membership, how do you know if there is a unanimous vote?
A vote may occur any Sunday, so hopefully this will encourage a fellow to come every Sunday, to keep what they find unbiblical from passing unanimously.
Do you spread �conclusions� even if they might be proven false?
Yes. As with an unbeliever the Holy Ghost later sanctifies into a believer, we believe that, should we be wrong, the God of Abraham will correct our conclusions in His time and way, and meanwhile we must do our best to spread the Gospel.
OUTREACH AND ACTIVITY GOALS
While we are a new and small fellowship, we seek to be used by the King of kings to spread His Word so we have outlined goals to build within our fellowship. Matthew 28:19
1. MISSIONS: We want to setup a program to send out missionaries to all nations. Though this may take a while, we will certainly reach out to our local community.
2. GROUPS: Daycare and Youth.
3. CHOIR: Anyone willing to participate and teach.
4. A BUILDING: While it is not the structure that makes our fellowship, we pray that, instead of renting, we will one day have a fixed place to gather.
We congregate every Sunday at 8:30 A.M.-12:30 and 2:00 P.M.-5:00 P.M.
