importance in knowing the Feast of the LORD--I THINK YOU ALL SHOULD READ THIS
Posted : 16 Dec, 2009 06:39 AM
Amen, Steve, very well put. For some reason legalism always reminds me of Pharisees. It isn't legalism that will save us for that is old law, under the new law we are saved by Grace, but I do have to say that it sort of amazes me the people that do not seek the Word and want to stand in obedience of it, for why would anyone want to serve an unchanging God, if they don't like the things He has put down to protect us? I don't expect the rules to change under my unchanging God, yet I see a lot of Christians out there taking opinion polls like somehow that is going to change anything if you can get any one to agree with you. Nothing we can say or do will change the mind set of God. He is not going to adjust His thinking to suit us, yet constantly I run into people that prefer their buffet style Christianity, saying the Bible is outdated or that that they only believe certain things in the Bible.
Talk about a giant mystery novel, I have to wonder how its all going to work out on the last page. So I guess I will continue to carry on as I know is right by the Word, and watch it all unfold in His Will.
Great point Mark, I like what you said about remembering who started this monkey business anyway. I like the thought of having a choice to take a higher road and not participate in his antics. We can't stop others, we can only control our own actions.
importance in knowing the Feast of the LORD--I THINK YOU ALL SHOULD READ THIS
Posted : 15 Dec, 2009 09:14 PM
Yes it is written that our works are like dirty rags on the floor, but it is also written in James that faith without works is dead.
Our works cannot get us into Heaven, but when the Spirit of the Lord is within us, we want to be more like Him. The Holy Spirit cannot be within you without changing you to be more like Him, preparing us for the Kingdom, a place where we can live in Peace in the Obedience of His Way.
We should all want to be more like Jesus, it is in the Nature of the Holy Spirit for us to want this. We are not meant to be dead in our faith, but to be Alive in the Spirit of Christ.
Good answer, Godslamb, and to that I might add that evil is enticing and people are easily led astray. We are our own worst enemies, and that is not gender specific.
What if the pastor to your church had an affair? What would your response be?
Posted : 15 Dec, 2009 03:51 AM
I think like most people, I would be shocked. I think I would pray the Lord take the reigns on this situation, for gossip is a vicious thing, and the allegation may not even be true, and whether its true or not, the people involved need God's intervention.
I would only consider leaving the church if he admitted the affair felt no need to adjust his standing in the church, for a fall of that magnitude screams of something that needs time and reflection which a pastor would not be able to do if he continued in his duties within the church for a spiritual leader is like a doctor for the soul and if he is deeply in need of healing himself, there is a problem. Stress from the job, something, has caused him to fall to a temptation that his strength in the Lord has not carried him through.
I think it is an arrogance to believe that you can be "caught" in something like this, admit and come clean, ask for forgiveness, and NOT address what it was that lead you astray, and as a Pastor this is not a band-aid fix answer, but something that needs to be stepped back and addressed before going forward, or there is a likely possibility it will happen again, for as a Pastor, he would have known it was wrong before he chose to step over the line, rather than flee from this path of destruction which is all to obvious before it is crossed.
I think in time he could return to his duties, but I think perhaps in another parish, for such talk is not going to go away, not ever really, it may settle, but it will leave a nasty stain, which in a perfect world all could forgive, but there is not such thing as a perfect church, not yet anyway, especially in a church where a pastor has taken a huge fall like that.
I think an attempt should be made to quell the gossip as much as anyone personally can for that in itself is just as ugly of stain as the act that led to the origin of the gossip. After all, one never really knows but what its a vicious rumor merely started by someone that doesn't want their spouse to attend church.
There are lots of lines of professionalism in our society that should never be crossed without stepping down. Affairs with clients are out of line in generally most all of them and when marriages and families enter into it, it only becomes worse.
Teachers do not sleep with their students, Doctors don't sleep with their patients, attorney's with clients, correctional staff with inmates, caregivers with clients, adults with children, and clergy with people they are leading or counseling. Today we see those lines blurred and crossed constantly. It is not our place to judge them, but to forgive them, to pray for them, and not to stand over them and laugh and toast marshmallows over them while they burn. Someday we could all be in that fire, whether we did something to warrant it or not.
I think it is just another sign of our terrible times, when our sacred oaths and vows mean so very little.
Wow, Dennis, very eye opening. I have some personal thoughts in reference to this topic that I wanted to share with you, but your age range excludes me my friend. You should adjust that a little so I can talk to you about that. I knew a lot of things about that period in history, but not that part of it, but I can see where it does fit in with their medical experiments to improve the master race.
Kimberly, I don't think Dennis was saying that you are out to gain ground in creating a master race, I think he just wanted you to be aware that the origin of this procedure was not as wholesome as science today would want us to believe.
I don't think anyone is hating on you are trying to bash you, but it looks like the bite goes both ways. I think they are just trying very hard to keep you from making a tragic mistake, but we all learn from our own tragic mistakes, and before we made them, no one could tell us anything that would keep us from making them either.
We just see you treading into very dangerous territory, but Arch is right, and as you have stated, there is no changing your mind on this. I am not sure the Wizard of Oz analogy made anyone feel any better, but I can appreciate your efforts of goodwill you had in mind in making them. I am not sure it was perceived the way it was intended, but that's okay, I will go with the intentions for which you meant.
I am scared for you Kimberly, and I think others here are as well, but I also know that the Lord allows us to walk through the fire to bring us to an understanding that we cannot gain until we do. I know this for having walked that stubborn path as well, and I truly believe that trial by fire Christians look at things in a way others do not. The problem with that path however is that it is extremely treacherous and not advisable for in the fire many burn for great is the despair and agony along the way. Things rarely happen according to our plans.
There is a saying, I have no idea where it comes from, that says "We make our plans, and God laughs" which basically means that our plans go array, and the Lord has other things in mind. Frankly I think the quote should go, "We make our plans and God cries.", for I think that is probably closer to the truth.
The way that I knew from the beginning Kimberly is because you knew your "friends" mind and thoughts too well. You defended her position too deeply in a way that was obviously your own, there was no lack of certainly on anything with it, and no one can know the mind of another so thoroughly, even in a marriage there are time when one is not certain of the how the other person thinks or feels about something. If you go back and read the thread, you will see my references to this mostly in places where I put the word "friend" in quotation as I just did now.
But none of that is relevant, Arch is right, you are our Sister, and often in the body when someone is making a mistake they get isolated like a virus, when they should be embraced, lifted up and kept in prayer. For anyone who has ever walked a bad path, which is pretty much everyone, should know that when you are on this path is when you need prayer most.
I think the very best prayer, that we can all agree on for you Kimberly, and I think you will agree upon it too, is "Thy Will Be Done Lord" in Kimberly's life, for whatever that means. Sometimes our blessings are the things that make us hit the wall, and become broken, for God uses broken things and where the breaking is great, generally so is the blessing.
It think you well know from our warnings that the path you are on is treacherous and risky, the best reason in the world why we should all stand in agreement on prayer with this, and I think that is a good prayer for you Kimberly, "Thy Will Be Done, Walk with me Lord" and that is a prayer I will stand on with you, for only God knows His Will for your life, and whatever that may be, the result is that it only brings you closer to Him.
I hope everyone will stand in agreement on this prayer with you Kimberly, for if it is His Will you enter down this path, than who are we to stand against it? We will stand in Prayer for His Will in your Walk with Him, for the Lord will not forsake any who seek genuinely seek Him, and if you walk through the fire, you will need the full armor my Sister.
As I read all the thoughts on this what I see is that Satan takes the qualities that stroke us best and exploits them, twists them. In the hypothetical concepts are adjusted and twisted to fit some less then relevant pattern. Like the older, less attractive waitress is somehow "lacking" in some quality of genuine warmth and sincerity. Trust me, a good waitress does not lack those qualities, and she was a great waitress. It isn't that she didn't make good tips, for she did. I knew them both very well. Both super people, but the attractive girl had no focus. If she had had no looks, she would have had no job, for I guarantee the complaints would have been stronger. Any woman that has ever worked as a waitress has seen this. Had a girl in my lobby the other day that was working as a cocktail waitress. I asked her if this was her first job in this type of business and she said it was. I asked her how she got her job, and she said she was shopping in the mall and the owner of the bar saw her and said she was attractive and would make a good waitress and should come down and apply. She was probably not over 22, if not just barely old enough to legally serve. People can deny this point all day long, but if you go into any place that is competitive in that market, they are not hiring the handicapped, or elderly, despite their experience and the reason for it is that people are forgiving of beauty, and are far less patient with someone that is physically less appealing to them.
Yes that is very shallow, welcome to the gene pool of a twisted world. But the world does not look with Christian eyes, it looks with worldly eyes, and as Christians, we need to constantly guard against the way Satan has programmed and twisted this.
I in no way mean to imply that people should not "take care" of themselves, for they should, but there is a difference between taking care of one self and adorning oneself beyond that point, which is HUGE today. What we are really talking about is vanity and how it feeds off lust. That is taking the laws of attraction and twisting and exploiting them, something the devil is good at. Something the devil is subtle at. Something we as people are often totally unaware of, mostly because when thing feel good, we don't want to take the time to look at them too closely from a Godlike perspective, for we might have to address it through faith if we see it for the way it is.
It is not wrong to find someone attractive, but make sure the reason you find them attractive is the right reason and not some twisted exploited reason. This is not at all directed toward men either for if you flip this pancake over, it is often just the same with women. You notice the scammers are not stealing average photos to hook people out there. In fact they often don't care the gender of the photo and will play with anyone that will take the bait.
We can deny it all we want to, but it is a blatant obvious fact that the world markets toward physical beauty and sexual attraction. You don't see a lot of marketing campaigns centered around what we should be looking at in a mate, like respect and integrity, sincerity and putting other in front of our own desires.
Whether someone is male or female, they need to guard their hearts against such things of the world and constantly ask themselves if this is a person the Lord would want for us, or if this is just something we want for ourselves.
And trust me, it is just as hard for Godly women as it is for Godly men. I in no way am trying to place the blame on one gender over another, for wicked is wicked is wicked and when we guard not our hearts we succumb to deceptive things. Even Solomon, a man of great wisdom, was seduced by sex and power. It is so easy to be led astray by the things that are pleasing to our eyes. Things that make us feel powerful or attractive, like a star that believes their own press on the way up, until the rags only want to print the next way to bring them down. That is just an amplified version of his tactics to deceive all of us.
I say that we should dwell not upon these tactics of the world around us, but should look with new eyes, the eyes the Lord wants us to have toward each other. I noticed that no one responded to the difference in that attraction of the eye before they were saved as opposed. I used to find the physical beauty, the bad boy thing hugely attractive. I can still feel that pull, but with the new eyes of understanding in the Lord, I look for a man that is concerned about his walk with Christ and what the Lord wants for him. That shows in the way he carries himself, respects himself and others, and in the way he has a working knowledge in the Word, and lives and walks in it.
The man I find most attractive right now, is a large man that is significantly struggling with his weight, but he has a kindness in him that is genuine, and he serves in the church willingly, loves the Lord and prays, puts other first. The Joy of the Lord flows from him. I would not have looked at him twice with worldly eyes, for I probably would not have seen him at all. I am comfortable around him, and do not feel like it is a job interview and if we both "pass" we become a couple.
But often the ones we hope take initiative often do not. These questions feel like a wrestling to escape that worldly grip, which in many ways is a trap that we rather like and don't mind being in cuz its appealing. Inner beauty doesn't fade cuz I guarantee that when you are in your mid nineties, even a girl twenty years younger isn't going to have bleached pearly whites, beautiful hair extensions and colored contacts that all make her look like a beautiful china doll.
Attractive is a Godly person that has been married to the same person for fifty years and still thinks they are the BEST thing that ever happened to them and they are truly fortunate to be richly blessed.
We know in our hearts if we are shallow, and quick to find an excuse to make it right or okay. We have all been there and done that. So stop wondering about why those around you do what they do, and put on the glasses of your faith to start seeing others with new eyes of faith and not the old vision of the world.
How do you see this warning that Christ warned us not to do? Judge not for ye shall be judged.
Posted : 14 Dec, 2009 05:59 AM
I think people often get hung up on judgment, sometimes confusing it with discernment, and often times clouded by conviction. We should not hate the sinner, only the sin. Casting stones, killing someone for what they have done that is perhaps no ones business, or at least no one with a stone in their hand.
What is discernment? How does it differ from judgment? Can you tell the difference? When you run into someone that cannot tell the difference, does it become your job to "point it out" for them? Why do people do this? Could it be the things within themselves that they hate? Their own convicted hearts, pointing at another, so no one will look at them? Or at least not look at them too closely?
Do we examine ourselves with as much harshness? Perhaps we should. I tend to believe if we truly look at what the Lord is trying to show us, that it is not the other persons short comings we are meant to find, but our own log that needs removing.
Pay attention to the attention you call upon others. If what you are pointing out are their flaws and short comings, that will someday be you as well. Point at them and tell them they are beautiful today, point them out and say didn't he do an amazing job! Point them out as being an example that you admire.
If you cannot point to their beauty, keep your pointing finger to yourself.
But also remember, if you ask for an honest critic of something, have the courage to listen for the truth in what you seek. It is not exactly finger pointing if you ask someone if you look fat in these jeans and they say that you do.
I learned a hard lesson a long time ago that if you listen carefully to the people that care about you, they will give you a reasonable assessment that should not be ignored. If you do not pay attention, the world will point its fingers at you and give you the same assessment, but it won't be nearly as kind. In that respect, and when it comes to judgment in general, we are most often our own worst enemies.
David the point is not of blame, but of the vicious circle. Women do it because men make it known that that's what they want, and men make it known that that is what they want because there are women modeling that behavior. As far as women checking women out, men check men out too, and to dig that just a little deeper look how many people are out there checking themselves out in the mirror at every opportunity. It all speaks to the shallowness of the world we live in. Add to that commercials, they constantly send the message that to get what you want you have to be prettier or richer or thinner, have better hair, drive a nicer car etc. The root of all of it is not Godly, yet we are all weak to some extent to the flesh, if you think I am wrong, just go out there and get a bad haircut sometime and see how it affects you.
I believe however when you become a Christian, you need to constantly check yourself at the door so to speak. In other words we need to self examine all the time for just such cracks in our armor. Are we part of the problem or part of the solution. How can one blame an unsaved person for being unsaved? God lets them have their choices, we need to allow that too, but as Christians we should strive toward holiness. Beauty fades, pure and simple. Everyone ages and battles with the things that come with age, which may not be the same from one to another, but each has their own set of aging issues that arise. It is not of us to remain young and beautiful in this life. Besides, what is beautiful anyway. If its in the eye of the beholder, tell me, how has your eye sight change upon being saved?
The waitress scenario was purely about looks, and looks alone for both women were truly beautiful people. One had excellent skills but faded looks and the other had the looks but not the skills in that area. She was lovable, just not a good waitress. The other was lovable too, she was just beyond that "cute as a speckled pup" thing. Is it offensive to consider, you bet. We don't like to think we are that way, but people associate eye pleasing with good, which is why so many con artists are so successful.
Funny how beauty can be such a cruel ugly fact, but honestly, that is why we need to seek the beauty within each other for that is a beauty that will never fade. Look for the beauty that makes you laugh, the beauty that comforts and consoles, the beauty that leads and respects.
Have your tastes changed since you became saved? Have they changed or are you still part of the "leering and primping crowd? What is it that impresses you, that persons joy, and laughter and heart, or their bleached teeth, colored contacts and hair extensions? Whether male or female, are you part of the solution or part of the problem?
